How Not To Save Seeds

[Myronr]

I had a similar problem with magazine paper.

[Worth1]

I haven't bought a paper plate or coffee filter in years.
I also can't remember the last time I bought paper towels.
Styrofoam also has no place in my home.
Mine are for environmental and financial reasons.
So any seeds really do get dried on real plates.
Worth

[SummerSky]

I used cheapo paper plates last year. I had to attack a few with a credit card (to scrape them off), but it worked well enough.

[seaeagle]

Originally Posted by Cole_Robbie

I use wax paper.

I've always used wax paper too.Surprised it took so long to be mentioned.The neat part about it is when they dry you can loosen them up and double the paper over and use it as a funnel.

[crmauch]

I'm a wax paper user too. Sometimes the seed will dry to the wax paper, but it is easily dislodged.

Originally Posted by seaeagle

I've always used wax paper too.Surprised it took so long to be mentioned.The neat part about it is when they dry you can loosen them up and double the paper over and use it as a funnel.

[seasyde]

I have found that baking parchment works well.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by seaeagle

I've always used wax paper too.Surprised it took so long to be mentioned.The neat part about it is when they dry you can loosen them up and double the paper over and use it as a funnel.

I agree but I'm not a funnel person unless you mean getting the dried seeds after the scraping to get them into containers. I only used paper, non coated plates, never foam plates, never wax paper and here's why.

When my fermentions are done, I do them, or did, in one pint containers I'd drain off as much residual water as I could and then knock the seeds out onto labelled paper plates,

You can never get all the water off those seeds so you need to put them on something that absorbs the water.

I'd spread the seeds around the plate with a finger, no way to keep them seperated at this point, and then with a finger pull to edge of the plate where there was no water any maggots that got into the fermentations. No water, maggots die. RIP

No I never covered the fermentations with cheesecloth or whatever since for many years I was setting up many pints/tray and usually was wroking with 4-5 trays at a time,

So I encourage all of you to use something like paper plates so that residual water is absorbed ASAP and you don'tlet the seeds sit in water.

When the seeds were completely dry I'd just scrape them off and put them into either vials or envelopes and then when needed would seperate the seeds in the clumps, count out the # of seeds needed and put then in labelled # 1 coin envelopes to send out,

Carolyn

[seaeagle]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

I agree but I'm not a funnel person unless you mean getting the dried seeds after the scraping to get them into containers. I only used paper, non coated plates, never foam plates, never wax paper and here's why.

When my fermentions are done, I do them, or did, in one pint containers I'd drain off as much residual water as I could and then knock the seeds out onto labelled paper plates,

You can never get all the water off those seeds so you need to put them on something that absorbs the water.

I'd spread the seeds around the plate with a finger, no way to keep them seperated at this point, and then with a finger pull to edge of the plate where there was no water any maggots that got into the fermentations. No water, maggots die. RIP

No I never covered the fermentations with cheesecloth or whatever since for many years I was setting up many pints/tray and usually was wroking with 4-5 trays at a time,

So I encourage all of you to use something like paper plates so that residual water is absorbed ASAP and you don'tlet the seeds sit in water.

When the seeds were completely dry I'd just scrape them off and put them into either vials or envelopes and then when needed would seperate the seeds in the clumps, count out the # of seeds needed and put then in labelled # 1 coin envelopes to send out,

Carolyn

Yes I meant funneling the seeds into containers. I really can't see why it's bad for seeds to sit in a little moisture for a few extra hours.They have spent their whole life in water up to that point.But while I have your attention I have a question.For a long time I just scraped the seeds out of the tomato with some gel and juice and some or the tomato got in there too.I started doing it the way you do it since I read your posts on fermenting.But the way I was doing it, the seeds fermented and all and I never had any problem.I guess my question is, does this method seem ok?I think I know your answer but I ask anyway

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by seaeagle

Yes I meant funneling the seeds into containers. I really can't see why it's bad for seeds to sit in a little moisture for a few extra hours.They have spent their whole life in water up to that point.But while I have your attention I have a question.For a long time I just scraped the seeds out of the tomato with some gel and juice and some or the tomato got in there too.I started doing it the way you do it since I read your posts on fermenting.But the way I was doing it, the seeds fermented and all and I never had any problem.I guess my question is, does this method seem ok?I think I know your answer but I ask anyway

Have you ever had fermented seeds germinate on the plate you dumped them on? I have. You say soak for just a few more hours, but that's not what always happens, b'c there may have been too much water that got on the plate, the humidity may have been high so the water didn't evaporate quickly, etc.

You say that seeds have spent their whole life in water, so I'm assuming you mean after you sow them in mix and then keep them watered. But that's a different situation IMO b'c the mix also absorbs water.

Yes, I have taken seeds from fruits, but rarely and not lately. The last time was when someone went to the Galapagos ISlands and I asked her to bring me back some S. cheesmanii, which is salt tolerant. How she got actual fruits through customs I don't know, but she sent me the fruits.

Being brief here, I knew they weren't what I asked for, called Dr Chatelet at the TGRC and since I knew the island they came from he was able to tell me what they could be.

So I scooped the seeds out of just one fruit, no processing at all and sowed them and got about 100% germination.

But the reason that I and most others do process seeds, me always by fermentation, is b'c if the fruits /seeds, are contaminated the fermentation can and does, if done correctly remove most of the pathogens that are on the seed coat most, but not all, and since transmission and infection are quantitative, there's less of a chance that such seeds can transmit infections, mainly for the foliage fungal ones since the bacterial ones are inside the seed.

And it can also lessen the possibility of transmission of some of the soil borne diseases such as Fusarium, Verticillium, etc.

Here's what happened to the ones I never processed:

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Sara%27s_Galapagos

Amy's daughter didn't go to the Galapogos as was said, but Amy named the variety for her.

I sent seeds from the plants I'd setout back to her and initially let her SSE list it, and then also listed it myself after that, and offered in many past seed offers here at Tville.

As Tania said in the link it tastes great and she highly recommends it, as do I.

Carolyn

[seaeagle]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

Have you ever had fermented seeds germinate on the plate you dumped them on? I have. You say soak for just a few more hours, but that's not what always happens, b'c there may have been too much water that got on the plate, the humidity may have been high so the water didn't evaporate quickly, etc.

You say that seeds have spent their whole life in water, so I'm assuming you mean after you sow them in mix and then keep them watered. But that's a different situation IMO b'c the mix also absorbs water.

Yes, I have taken seeds from fruits, but rarely and not lately. The last time was when someone went to the Galapagos ISlands and I asked her to bring me back some S. cheesmanii, which is salt tolerant. How she got actual fruits through customs I don't know, but she sent me the fruits.

Being brief here, I knew they weren't what I asked for, called Dr Chatelet at the TGRC and since I knew the island they came from he was able to tell me what they could be.

So I scooped the seeds out of just one fruit, no processing at all and sowed them and got about 100% germination.

But the reason that I and most others do process seeds, me always by fermentation, is b'c if the fruits /seeds, are contaminated the fermentation can and does, if done correctly remove most of the pathogens that are on the seed coat most, but not all, and since transmission and infection are quantitative, there's less of a chance that such seeds can transmit infections, mainly for the foliage fungal ones since the bacterial ones are inside the seed.

And it can also lessen the possibility of transmission of some of the soil borne diseases such as Fusarium, Verticillium, etc.

Here's what happened to the ones I never processed:

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Sara%27s_Galapagos

Amy's daughter didn't go to the Galapogos as was said, but Amy named the variety for her.

I sent seeds from the plants I'd setout back to her and initially let her SSE list it, and then also listed it myself after that, and offered in many past seed offers here at Tville.

As Tania said in the link it tastes great and she highly recommends it, as do I.

Carolyn

I wasn't really clear in what I typed.What I meant was I just scraped the seeds out of the tomato with the gel and still put them in water and they still looked liked they fermented . I just did not crush up the whole tomato. Regardless of whether it worked or not and it might have cause I never had any problem with much disease, I can see the logic in doing it your way by crushing the whole tomato up and fermenting.Simply because it the way the tomato does it naturally. Thank You for your reply

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by seaeagle

I wasn't really clear in what I typed.What I meant was I just scraped the seeds out of the tomato with the gel and still put them in water and they still looked liked they fermented . I just did not crush up the whole tomato. Regardless of whether it worked or not and it might have cause I never had any problem with much disease, I can see the logic in doing it your way by crushing the whole tomato up and fermenting.Simply because it the way the tomato does it naturally. Thank You for your reply

But I don't crush up the whole tomato.

Cut a tomatoin half and you see what are called the locules, individual chambers, if you will, seperated one from the other by a membrane.The seeds with their gel capsules are in those locules.

I take a fruit and with both thumbs split it apart and scoop out the seeds from the locules with my thumbs into my fermentation container. You always get a bit of those inner membranes as well.

The interior of a tomato is sterile, with one exception and not the time nor need to go into that here and now. So the seeds with gel capsules you take out are initially sterile.

Fermentation is dependent on enzymes that are made by primarily fungi and some bacteria in the air normally, that are allowed to land on the top of the tomato gunk in the fermentation vessel b'c they are what makes the enzymes that allows for fermentation.


Above you wrote:

(What I meant was I just scraped the seeds out of the tomato with the gel and still put them in water and they still looked liked they fermented .)

But they can't be fermented unless the typical fungal mat has been allowed to cover the tomato gunk.

One of the reasons I use clear containers to do my fermentations is so I can see how the fermentation is going and one of the best things to look for is the appearance of gas bubbles in the inner surface of the container, since fermentation does lead to gaseous end products as well as other non-gaseous products.

I can also see when a liquid clear area is at the bottom of the container and the tomato gunk at the top and see the fermented seeds, now with no gel capsules, at the bottom since the fermentation removes the gel capsules.

Hope the above helps,

Carolyn

[seaeagle]

Yes I always let the gunk or gook build up and all that, I guess I had kinda been doing it right all along.Oh well, either way works, I guess.Must have been somewhere else I read about fermenting the whole tomato.Sorry bout that.

[Tormato]

Originally Posted by Worth1

I use my fine Wedgwood China to dry mine on.
My seeds get nothing but the best.
Worth

Worth,

Take a step up to a Ming dynasty "chicken cup".

[slowpoke73ds]

I dried my seeds on a paper towel. Then i tore off a litt
le bit and planted the piece with the seeds stuck to it-- It has sprouted quite well

[pauldavid]

Originally Posted by slowpoke73ds

I dried my seeds on a paper towel. Then i tore off a litt
le bit and planted the piece with the seeds stuck to it-- It has sprouted quite well

I am glad its working out for you