Insect growth regulator

[b54red]

Has anyone tried insect growth regulator to help with spider mites or whiteflies? I have some that I thought I might try. I bought it for the expected flea problem which did not materialize this year which has made me and my dogs very happy.

The amount of pesticides required to control these two pests when they get thick is really more than I want to use on my tomatoes. This time of the year there are few beneficial insects in the garden; but plenty of spider mites, whiteflies, fire ants, and stink bugs. I think I will try it and see what happens. It may have no affect on the little buggers and sunlight should destroy its' effects fairly quickly after use; but if it will disrupt their life cycle and slow them down without using dangerous pesticides it could be a real plus.

[beeman]

When are you going to break down and try ACT? I'm not suggesting it's the be all and end all, but I don't have a fraction of the troubles you are getting. I don't have any bugs!
Is it possible that all the chemicals you have used have killed off all the good bugs, as well as the bad ones?

[b54red]

I still have a fair number of ladybugs, bees, lacewings and a ton of assassin bugs but I don't think any of them feed on spider mites or whiteflies. If they do they don't eat enough to keep the population from growing exponentially. I dare say that I also have an earthworm population in my garden that dwarfs yours.

During our very hot and very humid and very long summers the chance for diseases and pesky insects to flourish is in another league from what you deal with. Our winters don't usually kill off much in the way of diseases or pests due to their usually short and mild nature.

One of the reasons that I have troubles with whiteflies and spider mites this time of the year is the fact that I am one of the very rare gardeners that can grow tomatoes this time of the year down here. Most gardeners have long since pulled their tomato plants to wait for spring of next year to grow them again. From my small garden so far this year I have picked well over 1200 tomatoes and I'm not counting cherries. I like having some fresh tomatoes July through December so I have to deal with pests and diseases that are abundant during that time.
If all I wanted was a crop from the short season that you deal with then I could get by with many of the less than effective organic solutions you tout. Try keeping diseases off of foliage when the humidity is so high that when you go out into the garden in the mornings the water dripping off the plants sounds like rainfall with night time temps barely getting below 80.

I have found that most organic fertilizers are very effective but most organic fungicides are just the opposite in this climate. I use neem oil and it is somewhat effective for a short time but it seems that whiteflies develop a tolerance to it after only a couple of applications and it is ineffective on spider mites.

I have gardened in the same spot for 35 years and have tried nearly every touted solution for most garden problems and have only found a few that are what they are cracked up to be. That includes both chemical and biological solutions.

I am glad that those products seem to be working for you; but you have to understand we are gardening in climates that are as different as night and day.

[Heritage]

B54,

I'll be interested to see how the IGR's do against the mites. It's always the mites that determine the end of my regular tomato season. What IGR are you using?

Steve

[b54red]

It's out in my garden shed. I'll try to remember to write it down and give you the name. I sprayed it early this morning with a little pyrethrem and soapy water. I won't know if it does any good for a week or two.

The trouble with spider mites and whiteflies is not just what they do to the older fading plants but what they do to the new ones trying to survive in this heat. They can really sap a new seedling pretty fast and they don't yet have the root system to make up for the loss of moisture. I usually have to fight them off of my seedlings planted for fall tomatoes every year.

[b54red]

Steve the product I used is from Martin's. I checked the tomatoes yesterday and it seems to have had an affect on the mites. I saw almost no spider mites so I am assuming it is working but for how long I don't know. I think I will try it again next year and maybe apply it a little earlier and see if it will help stop the heavy infestations I get during the sometimes very long hot dry spells of late summer and fall. I'm not so sure about the whiteflies because I still see some but not in the numbers that were in my garden before. There is definitely a major drop in population but they could still make a comeback so I'll wait and see. Whiteflies sometimes get so thick in the fall that it is hard to breath when pruning, tying up plants, or picking tomatoes.

[Heritage]

b54,

Thanks for the update. It sounds like it is definitely worth trying.

Steve

[wingnut]

If you wish to eat growth regulators, have at it. The pyrmetrhrin and soapy water is a very effective insect killer on it's own......

[b54red]

Wingnut, the permethrin and soapy water is only effective for a few days down here. The only way to keep the mites and whiteflies under control when the infestation is heavy down here is to spray every 3 days and that is just too much poison and soap to keep applying for weeks on end. For mild infestations almost any contact poison and soap is effective; but ever few years we have absolute explosions in the whitefly and spider mite populations that will demolish healthy tomato plants.

[Heritage]

wingnut,

I've done your research for you. In particular, note the Summary Toxicity Information for each pesticide - compare the "Pan Bad Actor" column, the "Acute Toxicity" column, and the "Carcinogenic" column for each chemical:

Pyriproxyfen (the insect growth regulator used by b54):
http://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_...Rec_Id=PC35792

Permethrin :
http://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_...Rec_Id=PC35397

In addition, permethrin is extremely toxic to cats. Never shampoo your cat with a dog shampoo or flea control that contains permethrin.

Hope this helps.

Steve

[b54red]

Steve, I've been a dog owner for many years and have had to use permethrin at times when flea infestations are bad; and I am aware it is not safe for cats which I don't have. I feel much safer with the chemicals that I apply than what may be applied in foreign countries to much of the produce we find in our stores.

As for the growth regulator it sounds fairly benign and it has a fairly short life once exposed to sunlight for an extended period. I'm just hoping it will be effective enough to slow down the rapidly growing infestations of whiteflies and spider mites.

Bill

[lakelady]

Bill, it sure sounds like a never ending battle for you down there! NJ gets a lot of humidity, and my area more so as I live in the lakeland region of the state on a lake. Of course, we do get cold deep freezes too, so it helps us with insects.

Can you try covering your plants at all? Maybe some sort of mechanical barrier would help? You've probably thought of that, but it was what comes to mind when reading all of your insect woes.

[b54red]

Originally Posted by lakelady

Bill, it sure sounds like a never ending battle for you down there! NJ gets a lot of humidity, and my area more so as I live in the lakeland region of the state on a lake. Of course, we do get cold deep freezes too, so it helps us with insects.

Can you try covering your plants at all? Maybe some sort of mechanical barrier would help? You've probably thought of that, but it was what comes to mind when reading all of your insect woes.

It's just part and parcel of living down here. You should see our roaches and mosquitos.

Actually this spring the insects were not much of a problem because we had a colder winter than usual and they only got bad in late July. I had very few tomato hornworms and only a mild case of aphids. Gray mold has actually been the biggest problem this year besides the ever present fusarium. Septoria has gotten worse the last few weeks probably spread by the whiteflies; but early blight has only been a minor problem this year. Heat and drought have been nearly the worst I've ever seen because the heat hit new highs in May and has been pretty constant since then.

The great thing about growing tomatoes down here is the very long growing season. I have been eating fresh tomatoes since May and hopefully will be picking a few right up til it freezes which may not come til late November or December. We are supposed to get cooler weather this coming week and maybe the tomatoes will have a little better time of it.

[Heritage]

Bill,

I wasn't commenting on your use of permethrins, rather the comparative safety of the two pesticides - something you already know.

Originally Posted by b54red

Steve, I've been a dog owner for many years and have had to use permethrin at times when flea infestations are bad; and I am aware it is not safe for cats which I don't have. I feel much safer with the chemicals that I apply than what may be applied in foreign countries to much of the produce we find in our stores.
Bill

[Tracydr]

I had a horrible infestation of spider mites during our record hot August this summer. I was just about to pull out the plants, since soap spray wasnt working. Last week, I decided to spray Adams Flea spray for dogs and cats with IGR. It looks like it might have worked!