Anybody Plant Pole Beans?

[clkeiper]

Jack, Thanks for the small laugh about the organics and Christianity...It's bordering on true though and that is kind of scary. Organic pesticides can be far more dangerous than the synthetics. They think if it says organic that it is not sprayed.duh!

I do want to sat that I am amazed that the consumers there are unwilling to try anything different. Up here the different it is the easier I can sell it. I never bring home anything from my market that is purple. It always sells and then I have people asking for it the rest of the market. I have also found that if you put a price on it it does become more valuable to them. I realize that you do a community "free" stand, but I have found that people do utilize the food better if they have to pay something for it. I couldn't give cherry tomatoes away two years ago. I started putting them in pints and charging whatever the price was in the store and I don't have enough now. Makes no sense to me.

I hope next year you have a little more rain and a little less heat. Maybe we could swap some of those conditions. We need more heat and less rain. I'm already praying.

[JackE]

"I hope next year you have a little more rain and a little less heat. Maybe we could swap some of those conditions. We need more heat and less rain. I'm already praying"

I do have to admit that I'm starting to believe in "global warming". but I'm not as convinced of the cause as some folks are.

How 'bout a first name? - Bob, George, Nancy - anything but Sue! LOL Keep prayin' we need it here - I guess we ALL need it, huh?

Jack

[clkeiper]

Jack, my name is Carolyn....right there at the bottom of the post just like it says.

[Worth1]

Jack,
You would be surprised at how many people grow produce for farmers markets that grow organically.

Further more if you were to venture out of this section of Tomatoville and someone stood on you too hard (Got Nasty with you) about pesticides and fertilizers they would be banned from the forum. I have seen this happen more than once here.
You might say we are intolerant of intolerance.
I know I am.

You will also find many if not most people that are into organics are just as theological as you are.
I dont hold one theology over another I except people as they are as long as they do the same with me.
Don't confuse respect for nature with the worship of nature.
We are all stewards of this planet.

The reason I posted the link to you on legumes was to send you where there was good information on varieties of beans.

Worth

[JackE]

You would be surprised at how many people grow produce for farmers markets that grow organically.

Not at all surprised, Worth. Like Moon said, in upscale suburban markets they won't buy anything that's not organic - that's why they go to a farmers market and pay three prices for a tomato. It's also a rapidly growing market - now even the box stores are getting on the organic bandwagon.

But with most market growers it's a business decision, not a matter of ideology. I know a guy who had 5 acres in Montgomery County (for non Texans - an affluent suburb north of Houston.) He literally made a fortune growing organic vegetables there. He has since succumbed to the developers and sold the land, but the last time I visited him there were a bunch of Mercedes' and BMW's parked in front of his stand and a line of young soccer moms in jogging clothes and well-tanned, well-healed matronly ladies in white tennis togs and golfing garb forking over BIG bucks for his organic Brandywine tomatoes! And I mean BIG bucks - five bucks apiece! That was a few years ago - the market is even more lucrative now.

I assure you, Worth, that if I were going to grow for profit, I would grow organically (I'd have to move to better soil, though) and sell my stuff in Houston.

So it's all about business on these commercial forums - they don't proselytize. Why create competition?

Jack

PS - Respect easily becomes love and love becomes worship. Admittedlly, modern nature worshippers don't build a bonfire and dance around it naked, or pile stones in a circle, but much of what I see and read is certainly tantamount to worship, if not worship in the traditional sense.

[Worth1]

I wasn't aware anyone was proselytizing in any other part of this forum.

Worth

[JackE]

Maybe not - and hopefully the moderators - which are VERY GOOD here, the best I've ever seen - will want to keep it that way. And I'm sure they are more comfortable keeeping my over-active mouth confined to one area of the site!

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by JackE

Maybe not - and hopefully the moderators - which are VERY GOOD here, the best I've ever seen - will want to keep it that way. And I'm sure they are more comfortable keeeping my over-active mouth confined to one area of the site!

Jack, here I am.

I do think it's best to realize that what might work for you using your methods and products doesn't work for everyone, so perhaps a bit more tolerance might be considered for others who have different growing concerns.

You say that organically grown crops are becoming big time where you are, but that's not true where I am. At first everyone who did small scale farming wanted to go the organic route with the belief that they could get a premium price, but that's not what happened.

Many of the them got certified organic by NOFA which is the main organic certifying agency here. They were left not being able to control the many diseases they were able to in the past.

Kocide was one that many used and was initially approved by NOFA but then NOFA said that one was out b'c the inert ingredients were not specified on the label.

So quite a few have stopped trying to grow organically, and I think the main reason around here is that they refuse to pay the premiam price associated and b'c there are lots of alternatives in my area with reasonably priced produce that is cheaper to buy.

In addition, there's all sorts of organic standards from a local agency such as NOFA and MOGFA, and the latter was the source for almost all other certifying agencies and have stornger standards than the Federal ones last I knew.

And the you've got the Federal standards with FOUR levels of organicness.

So if going by the Fed standards who knows HOW organic something is.

If it sounds as though I know some local folks who have gone organic and why they aren't going to pay the steep yearly costs to maintain that certification you'd be correct.

Posting here at Tville has the same guidelines for ALL Forums so this Market Garden Forum is the same as all others in that respect as to interaction with others who post in this Forum.

And I just wrote that b'c of your comment above:

(And I'm sure they are more comfortable keeeping my over-active mouth confined to one area of the site! )

Nope, all Forums, all areas of Tomatoville are moderated the same and have the same guidelines, no special perks for this Forum.

[JackE]

You say that organically grown crops are becoming big time where you are, but that's not true where I am. At first everyone who did small scale farming wanted to go the organic route with the belief that they could get a premium price, but that's not what happened.

That really surprises me. Most of my info is, however, out-of-date - based mostly on a life experiences from the past. Due to advancing age, something that happened 20 yrs ago often seems like last year.

I would expect, though, that the recession is having some impact on this. Some of those young suburban families have had to tighten their budgets and eliminated some luxuries. Heirloom, vine-ripened Brandywine tomatoes, along with the matching BMW's, is certainly a luxury by anyone's standard.

Where we are there is no demand for organic, other than an occasional person passing through who stops at our stand. Healthy eating habits are correlated with education and income, both of which are lacking in rural Texas.

Jack

[lakelady]

Well I frequently don't look at the different forum headings and just pop in with my two cents, lol...so sorry if I'm speaking as someone who has no idea how difficult commecial growing is, but I do give you all credit for it. I can barely manage my little tiny gardens here, so kudos to those of you who grow on a larger scale. It boggles my mind really.

As far as organics or not organics, I try to be organic simply because I don't know enough about the chemicals being used, and what is safe or what is not. I try to read here on the forums to learn those things because next year, come hell or high water, I'm getting GOOD tomato crops for sure

[Worth1]

If it kills spiders, frogs toads and lizards I wont use it.

Worth

[JackE]

Antonette, it's no harder technically-speaking to grow an acre of tomatoes than growing a couple of plants in containers - maybe even LESS challenging - but it's sure a heck of a lot more dummie work!

I'm worried about our help next year. My two best, and most dependable, volunteer ladies drifted away when we shut-down in June (drought) and got involved in another mission project (gathering medical supplies for our SBC doctors and nurses in Zimbabwe). I'm not sure I'll get them back. Most of our people are too old for stoop labor (and I'm getting there fast - I was walking on my knees this year while weaving tomatoes - in extreme pain!)

Jack

[GIZZARDFARM]

For my pole beans i use 16 ft cattle panels arched between metal t-posts, i plant a row inside and out on each side. you can adjust height to your comfortable picking height. most beans are fron the 9:00 and 3:00 oclock areas, easy pickin and added shade while picking as i have a hundred foot row of these. as they are around 20.00 each i buy 5 each year and add to the tunnel. Try it and youll never go back to trellising or hog wire again i promise