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Old 3 Days Ago   #121
bower
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackBear View Post
WOW !
This is another factor to consider if the OP seedlings available in a local area
are not as the same attributes ...they used to be .

So... does it also follow that ....Hybrids that depend on the OP "heirloom"

parents ...may also NOT be what they used to in original Golden age
of development and release to public. ?
The companies that produce hybrid seed have a pretty big job - not just making the crosses and harvesting the seeds. They have to maintain their true breeding lines - in other words, growing them out in numbers and carefully selecting to make sure nothing is lost in the line. Otherwise the hybrid seed quality would indeed deteriorate, it seems.

I think it would be a bit of a stretch to think that none of our heirlooms/OP's are as good as they once were. Lets not forget that 'average' means no change. vs exceptional (2 percent or less?) and worse (?? no data given for that). I'm guessing that average is the bigger slice.
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Old 2 Days Ago   #122
RJGlew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bower View Post
I think it would be a bit of a stretch to think that none of our heirlooms/OP's are as good as they once were. Lets not forget that 'average' means no change. vs exceptional (2 percent or less?) and worse (?? no data given for that). I'm guessing that average is the bigger slice.
Agreed no data. However, the author's suggestion that significant negative genetic drift occurrs in just 20-30 years of seed saving without proper selection processes indicates that `worse' occurs more often than `better.'
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Old 2 Days Ago   #123
DonDuck
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If we selected a few of the latest, purist bred; open pollinated varieties with the best qualities and returned them to the environment where the original "wild" tomatoes thrived without human interference; assuming genetic drift or natural mutation is real, would they revert to their original phenotype or develop a totally new variety? That would assume no cross breeding from outside influence occurred and all conditions are the same as they were when the wild tomatoes prospered. If they revert to their original form, would it require one hundred years or one thousand years?
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Old 1 Day Ago   #124
Black Krim
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More importantly is to maintain the selection pressure to keep good varieties strong and viable and true to their intended use.

Some years ago a man, Don Schrider, spent just a few years to rejuvenate an old nearly forgotten breed of chicken: the buckeye. He took several lines, carefully selected from dedicated poutlrymen to begin again by mixing these lines in a planned method to increase genetic diversity AND improve the quality of the carcass to what it used to be. The genes were still there--just needed selection to push from average to better than average.

http://livestockconservancy.org/inde...tion-successes

Secure & Sustain:

staff member Jeannette Beranger and former staffer Don Schrider developed a master breeder program for Buckeye chickens that has set the gold standard for expansion and selection of rare chicken breeds.

Unfortunately I could not find his original publication, where it gives just a few short years to creat this success. ANd I mean Just a few, like 4-5 years.

Last edited by Black Krim; 1 Day Ago at 12:37 AM.
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Old 1 Day Ago   #125
Black Krim
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"Some of Andrey's Siberian tomatoes fit the bill. I really like Gribovsky, good shelf life, productive, tolerates cold, no splitting ever, can do without staking, and the flavor is good to great when all cylinders are firing. . fruit size is 75-150 grams. Alc1gene plays a major role with Gribovsky."

http://t.tatianastomatobase.com/w/im...kiy_Plant1.jpg
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