L. pimpinellafolium x Bonner F1 and F2 - Page 2

**Mischka** · August 29, 2009

I'm pretty sure that Carolyn mentioned having it happen in her garden and I hope she'll chime in to confirm it.

frogsleap farm · October 17, 2009

A progress report. I had another banner year for Septoria, except for those beds where I used fungicidal control. Although I am seeing some progress in my longer term project in selecting for Septoria tolerance within heirloom types, the S. pimpinellifolium project has been discouraging. Levels of Septoria tolerence in these lines was inferior to other more adapted lines in my Septoria nursery, and the progeny from these "wild crosses" have various minor/major agronomic flaws. I am keeping a couple of very early rugose lines from this cross, but that's a different project. It's interesting that the Cornell SLS project used the same pimpinellifolium PI that I did, though combined this with one or more hirsutum crosses - they are reporting progress on developing resistant/tolerant lines.

goodwin · October 18, 2009

frogsleap -
Good luck with this project. I'm concerned we could see the end of a number of our heritage types unless people like you and Tom Wagner make this effort. Certainly, the big seed companies and breeding programs have no interest in rescuing heirloom tomatoes.
Remember I said we don't have Septoria out here? Well, now we do.
Anyway, I have those hirsutum crosses and a couple disease resistant strains which might show promise. If you want to exchange some seed and work crosses on both ends, let me know. I'll help in any way I can.

DKelly · January 30, 2010

This appears to be a chimera.

goodwin · February 4, 2010

Some interesting progeny from one of the original hirsutum crosses. A few are PL and very bright green. I potted them up today. The parent threw high brix, good-sized fruit with green gel last year.

goodwin · July 16, 2010

Just a followup. I'd mentioned some of the original hirsutum crosses were quite vigorous and productive. Now some F3 plants are beginning to produce. I'd guess this one has some 200 tomatoes between 1/2" and 1 1/4" in diameter. It's about 3' tall, RL and indeterminate. The first ones just ripened and were quite good. We'll have to see if these traits carry over to the next generation, but this strain might be something I could use in the greenhouse in the fall.

**Mischka** · July 17, 2010

"/raises hand to volunteer to grow-out some next generation seed in 2011."

Stepheninky · September 29, 2010

I am doing a closet grow out of Lycopersicon esculentum x peruvianum which is supposted to be a natural cross and a f1 hybid of Lycopersicon hirsutum x esculentum to get F2 (? in the process of asking the vender about any history he might be able to find out about the seed) seed to grow out and share in spring. So will be posting my progress on that thread and on the My Wild Tomato Breeding Project thread. So definitely glad I found this post as seeing what you guys have done so far is really nice.

frogsleap farm · September 29, 2010

I am frankly doubtful that the vendor's description is accurate. As I recall there are serious fertility barriers to crossing with peruvianum; and hirsutum F1's are marginally fertile with primarily green fruited hybrids. Introgression of genes/traits from these sources is possible (and has been done), but entails some heavy lifting. L/S pimpinellifolium is easily crossed to esculentum, with fully fertile hybrids - the low hanging fruit of interspecific crossing.

Stepheninky · September 30, 2010

As far as the vender's description IDK I have asked for more info and will update here what they send back to me

My understanding is that the wild type should be used as the male parent in the cross, and then that is iffy.

Here is an abstract I found which seems interesting. Trying to figure out what they mean by Treatment of Lycopersicon peruvianum stigmas with an artificial medium analogous to stigmatic exudate allowed pollen germination and growth on immature pistils. ?

Abstract
Treatment of Lycopersicon peruvianum stigmas with an artificial medium analogous to stigmatic exudate allowed pollen germination and growth on immature pistils. Growth of Lycopersicon esculentum pollen tubes to L. peruvianum ovules, an otherwise incompatible cross, was achieved following such treated bud-pollinations. No plantlets were recovered, although a few embryos from this cross at the globularity heart stage of development were excised at 22 days after pollination, indicating the presence of crossing failures as severe as in the reciprocal cross. Hybrid plants were obtained from the reciprocal cross, using as pollen parent an L. peruvianum line selected for congruity with L. esculentum. Bud pollinations to L. peruvianum, using these interspecific F1 hybrids as the pollen parent, allowed viable embryo development and plantlet recovery. Resulting backcross plants, which possess approximately 1/4 L. esculentum genome in a L. peruvianum cytoplasm, may facilitate further introgression of the L. esculentum nuclear genes into in foreign cytoplasm.

Stepheninky · September 30, 2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by frogsleap farm

I am frankly doubtful that the vendor's description is accurate. As I recall there are serious fertility barriers to crossing with peruvianum; and hirsutum F1's are marginally fertile with primarily green fruited hybrids. Introgression of genes/traits from these sources is possible (and has been done), but entails some heavy lifting. L/S pimpinellifolium is easily crossed to esculentum, with fully fertile hybrids - the low hanging fruit of interspecific crossing.

This species is native to Peru and southern parts of Ecuador and has very small, green, hairy fruit. The species is divided into to seperate subspecies, L. hirsutum f. typicum and L. hirsutum f. glabratum.
L[COLOR="DarkSlateGray"]. hirsutum f. typicum is often found in higher elevations river valleys (between 1,800 and 3,300m) from southern Ecuador to central Peru. It is a strong outbreeder with a very long exerted stigma. Most PI's are self-incompatible. Those that have permitted selfing produce weak progeny which suffer greatly from inbreeding depression. This subspecies does not readily cross with L. esculentum. The other subspecies, L. hirsutum f. glabratum, easily accomodates self-fertilization and progeny do not suffer from inbreeding depression. It is found in the southwestern parts of Ecuador at lower latitudes (0-6 degrees south). This subspecies is capable of crossing with L. esculentum.

Finally found were I had seen that L. hirsutum f. glabratum could be crossed to the cultivated tomato and not suffer inbreeding depression. Here is a link to thepage that this info came from
http://www.kdcomm.net/~tomato/Tomato/ecomplx.html#6tom

If my understanding is correct it depends on the sub species

frogsleap farm · September 30, 2010

With your interest in exotic germplasm, another place you might want to look is the U.S. Plant Introduction System. There are several PIs tracing to interspecific crosses made by scientists at various institutions. I have evaluated a few, specifically looking for increased tolerance to Septoria. They are interesting, but need a lot of work.

ireilly · September 30, 2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stepheninky

Here is an abstract I found which seems interesting. Trying to figure out what they mean by Treatment of Lycopersicon peruvianum stigmas with an artificial medium analogous to stigmatic exudate allowed pollen germination and growth on immature pistils. ?

Not sure what the question is about it. This link to a brief extract explains the role of stigmatic exudate a little, albeit in palms.

http://ajol.info/index.php/joafss/article/view/33775

Stepheninky · September 30, 2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by ireilly

Not sure what the question is about it. This link to a brief extract explains the role of stigmatic exudate a little, albeit in palms.

http://ajol.info/index.php/joafss/article/view/33775

Guess the question was what could they be using as the substance for use as an artificial medium analogous to stigmatic exudate?

Fusion_power · March 1, 2011

Resurrecting this thread to post that I have a few lines from frogleap and a large collection of lines from TGRC to evaluate. I plan on growing about 1000 plants this year in an area that is heavily hit by septoria every year. By this time next year, I hope to have several identified lines with some tolerance and hopefully 2 or 3 that are highly tolerant.

DarJones

August 29, 2009	#16
Mischka Tomatoville® Administrator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: The Bay State Posts: 3,207	I'm pretty sure that Carolyn mentioned having it happen in her garden and I hope she'll chime in to confirm it. __________________ Mischka One last word of farewell, Dear Master and Mistress. Whenever you visit my grave, say to yourselves with regret but also with happiness in your hearts at the remembrance of my long happy life with you: "Here lies one who loved us and whom we loved." No matter how deep my sleep I shall hear you, and not all the power of death can keep my spirit from wagging a grateful tail.

July 17, 2010	#22
Mischka Tomatoville® Administrator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: The Bay State Posts: 3,207	"/raises hand to volunteer to grow-out some next generation seed in 2011." __________________ Mischka One last word of farewell, Dear Master and Mistress. Whenever you visit my grave, say to yourselves with regret but also with happiness in your hearts at the remembrance of my long happy life with you: "Here lies one who loved us and whom we loved." No matter how deep my sleep I shall hear you, and not all the power of death can keep my spirit from wagging a grateful tail.

October 17, 2009	#17
frogsleap farm Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Minnesota Posts: 568	A progress report. I had another banner year for Septoria, except for those beds where I used fungicidal control. Although I am seeing some progress in my longer term project in selecting for Septoria tolerance within heirloom types, the S. pimpinellifolium project has been discouraging. Levels of Septoria tolerence in these lines was inferior to other more adapted lines in my Septoria nursery, and the progeny from these "wild crosses" have various minor/major agronomic flaws. I am keeping a couple of very early rugose lines from this cross, but that's a different project. It's interesting that the Cornell SLS project used the same pimpinellifolium PI that I did, though combined this with one or more hirsutum crosses - they are reporting progress on developing resistant/tolerant lines.

October 18, 2009	#18
goodwin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Espanola, New Mexico Posts: 606	frogsleap - Good luck with this project. I'm concerned we could see the end of a number of our heritage types unless people like you and Tom Wagner make this effort. Certainly, the big seed companies and breeding programs have no interest in rescuing heirloom tomatoes. Remember I said we don't have Septoria out here? Well, now we do. Anyway, I have those hirsutum crosses and a couple disease resistant strains which might show promise. If you want to exchange some seed and work crosses on both ends, let me know. I'll help in any way I can.

January 30, 2010	#19
DKelly Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Hawaii Posts: 88	This appears to be a chimera.

February 4, 2010	#20
goodwin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Espanola, New Mexico Posts: 606	Some interesting progeny from one of the original hirsutum crosses. A few are PL and very bright green. I potted them up today. The parent threw high brix, good-sized fruit with green gel last year.

September 29, 2010	#23
Stepheninky Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Kentucky Posts: 682	I am doing a closet grow out of Lycopersicon esculentum x peruvianum which is supposted to be a natural cross and a f1 hybid of Lycopersicon hirsutum x esculentum to get F2 (? in the process of asking the vender about any history he might be able to find out about the seed) seed to grow out and share in spring. So will be posting my progress on that thread and on the My Wild Tomato Breeding Project thread. So definitely glad I found this post as seeing what you guys have done so far is really nice.

September 30, 2010	#25
Stepheninky Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Kentucky Posts: 682	As far as the vender's description IDK I have asked for more info and will update here what they send back to me My understanding is that the wild type should be used as the male parent in the cross, and then that is iffy. Here is an abstract I found which seems interesting. Trying to figure out what they mean by Treatment of Lycopersicon peruvianum stigmas with an artificial medium analogous to stigmatic exudate allowed pollen germination and growth on immature pistils. ? Abstract Treatment of Lycopersicon peruvianum stigmas with an artificial medium analogous to stigmatic exudate allowed pollen germination and growth on immature pistils. Growth of Lycopersicon esculentum pollen tubes to L. peruvianum ovules, an otherwise incompatible cross, was achieved following such treated bud-pollinations. No plantlets were recovered, although a few embryos from this cross at the globularity heart stage of development were excised at 22 days after pollination, indicating the presence of crossing failures as severe as in the reciprocal cross. Hybrid plants were obtained from the reciprocal cross, using as pollen parent an L. peruvianum line selected for congruity with L. esculentum. Bud pollinations to L. peruvianum, using these interspecific F1 hybrids as the pollen parent, allowed viable embryo development and plantlet recovery. Resulting backcross plants, which possess approximately 1/4 L. esculentum genome in a L. peruvianum cytoplasm, may facilitate further introgression of the L. esculentum nuclear genes into in foreign cytoplasm.

March 1, 2011	#30
Fusion_power Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,250	Resurrecting this thread to post that I have a few lines from frogleap and a large collection of lines from TGRC to evaluate. I plan on growing about 1000 plants this year in an area that is heavily hit by septoria every year. By this time next year, I hope to have several identified lines with some tolerance and hopefully 2 or 3 that are highly tolerant. DarJones