Tomato spacing in 4'x4' space?

[linzelu100]

I am building raised beds for next year, to help with drainage. 4 x 4 feet, 1 foot deep. I had a lot of issues with blight/dieseases on my tomatoes this year in my new home. I was thinking I should be cautious and plant one tomato per bed, so leaves don't touch. But if I prune instead could I plant more in that space? Is there anyway I could plant more in that space safely without increasing my disease chances?

ThaNks, Lindsey

[Father'sDaughter]

I stake and prune to a few stems, so if it were me I would do three plants in that bed in a triangle pattern. Part of my pruning is to ensure air circulation around each plant by trimming branches that grow into another plants air space.

[Redbaron]

2-4 determinates or dwarf tomatoes or 1 sprawling indeterminate. However, to increase productivity, try companion planting. Lots of things grow great with tomatoes and can be planted all around them. Basil, oregano, parsley, chives, cilantro, borage, garlic, lavender, lovage, tarragon are all good herbs to grow with tomatoes. Carrots, celery, onions are good veggies to grow with them. Marigolds, geraniums, petunias, nasturtium, zinnia are good flowers to grow with them. I even plant sunflowers near tomatoes (at a good distance).

[kath]

It depends on your goals, I think. Will you using any preventive spray, Lindsey? Is one of your goals to grow a lot of different varieties? Will you have easy access to all sides of the 4' square?

That's a lot of space and if you're growing in a cage and not pruning much, one plant would be the safest bet. However, if you will be keeping the plants pruned to a single stem you can space two rows along two sides of the bed and get at least 6 plants in that space, if not 8. In my super-humid conditions, I've had them spaced as close as 14" in staggered double rows that were too narrow to walk between when the plants were full size (less than 3' apart) and didn't have any more disease problems than when they were 3-4' apart. I'd set the plants 6" from the edges to give them the most air flow in the center.

A preventive spray program beginning when the plants are first taken outside is critical.

kath

[linzelu100]

Kath,

My goals are to produce our tomatoes for the year. Minimum of 52 pints of tomato sauce and a few jars of chopped tomatoes, all the fresh beefsteaks/cherries we can eat in a summer. Also, since I am a seed-saving tomato addict I like to trial lots of new to me varieties and save seed from old and new alike. Each square will only have one type of tomato.

I wil have access from all sides. 4 foot pathways between all 4x4 foot beds. I am planning on using an organic preventitive fungal spray weekly/biweekly (as it seems necessary here in Virginia).

6-8 seems like too many for my abilities. I was hoping to push it to 4. My current tomatoes are spaced in 2 feet squares like that now (so identical spacing) and there is a lot of touching of leaves/transferring of diseases. But I thought if I learned to prune properly maybe I could grow them better next time.

I have stakes and cages- I can do either method.

Lindsey

[habitat_gardener]

Originally Posted by linzelu100

...Each square will only have one type of tomato....

One variety per square? In that case, I'd put one plant per square. I usually plant too close so that I can fit in more varieties. In general, it seems I get the same production I'd get from half as many plants spaced properly. So if I were growing a single variety in a given space, I'd give it lots of room.

[linzelu100]

Yeah I meant one variety per square and I grow heirloom indeterminates.

[kath]

Originally Posted by linzelu100

Kath,

My goals are to produce our tomatoes for the year. Minimum of 52 pints of tomato sauce and a few jars of chopped tomatoes, all the fresh beefsteaks/cherries we can eat in a summer. Also, since I am a seed-saving tomato addict I like to trial lots of new to me varieties and save seed from old and new alike. Each square will only have one type of tomato.

I wil have access from all sides. 4 foot pathways between all 4x4 foot beds. I am planning on using an organic preventitive fungal spray weekly/biweekly (as it seems necessary here in Virginia).

6-8 seems like too many for my abilities. I was hoping to push it to 4. My current tomatoes are spaced in 2 feet squares like that now (so identical spacing) and there is a lot of touching of leaves/transferring of diseases. But I thought if I learned to prune properly maybe I could grow them better next time.

I have stakes and cages- I can do either method.

Lindsey

Seems like you should take the cautious route and go with one plant per square, Lindsey. Unless you're familiar with the growth habit of all your varieties when they're pruned to a single vine, there's no way to tell how wide each one will get and you need to know that to plan the spacing if you don't want leaves of one plant touching the next one. Otherwise you might have to prune your plants with hedge trimmers!

That's a lot of jars, btw- hope you're planning to build a lot of squares!

kath

[tlintx]

I would suggest planting a box or at least a row or two of a reliable determinate or canner as insurance. And a Juliet or a Reisentraube as insurance for your insurance.

Why 4x4, by the way? I have one that size and it's too, I don't know, square! I always feel like I'm having to stretch to reach the middle squares! I much prefer 6 x 3.

In my 4x4 I had four plants (one det, one cherry, one indet, and one Red Fig) in the spring, which was fine as long as I kept up with it. I didn't prune, just tied whatever grew to the stake.

In the 6x3 I think I have twelve plants right now, staggered. Back row is Florida Weave, front row is staked individually. And a 6" row of just-sowed leafy greens at the very front. And a pumpkin at each end, between the two rows.

Tl

[RobinB]

I have a front yard full of 4' square raised beds. I plant 4 tomatoes per box, either on each corner or one in the middle of each side. It's never been a problem. I'm in the desert though, so humidity isn't an issue.

[TomatoDon]

If you are only going to make the beds 4x4 I think your optimum would be one plant per bed. Two indeterminates is really going to crowd that space when they get tall and filled out. My beds are 5 feet wide and when the plants are filled out they lap together in the middle and bush out past the edge of the bed.

If I was going with a 4x4 that I could only grow one plant in comfortably in, I'd just get a 30-40 gallon container and use that. Would be a lot cheaper, and you could also move it around if you need to.

The other thing to consider, if you are going to have one plant per bed I'd rather have a 2x2 or a 3x3 with one plant each. A 4x4, in my opinion, is too big for one plant but not big enough for two comfortably.

But still if the optimum is one plant per bed I'd just get a container and forget all the labor and expense of building a bed.

[macbettz]

I would agree, 4x4 seems a bit llarge for 1 plant but too small for 2. I would probably plant one tomato plant and one eggplant or pepper plant in each 4x4

[linzelu100]

Originally Posted by kath

Seems like you should take the cautious route and go with one plant per square, Lindsey. Unless you're familiar with the growth habit of all your varieties when they're pruned to a single vine, there's no way to tell how wide each one will get and you need to know that to plan the spacing if you don't want leaves of one plant touching the next one. Otherwise you might have to prune your plants with hedge trimmers!

That's a lot of jars, btw- hope you're planning to build a lot of squares!

kath

Well Kath, I don't know anything about pruning to one stem- so this would be a first. What it really comes down to, is I want to grow great tomatoes, great eating quality. But in my new homes state of Virginia- I am having difficulty growing tomatoes period. I am trying to get ahead of the game for next year so I can have tomatoes. I'll do whatever I need to do to grow better tomatoes- just lacking the know how in this new hot-humid-wet environment. I know all my neighbors/farmers/local growers are having a heck of a time too this year, but they are still growing some. I am real curious to learn about your method though, it seems like you have it down to a working system.

I was planning on builind 28 squares. Still need more you think?

[linzelu100]

Originally Posted by TomatoDon

If you are only going to make the beds 4x4 I think your optimum would be one plant per bed. Two indeterminates is really going to crowd that space when they get tall and filled out. My beds are 5 feet wide and when the plants are filled out they lap together in the middle and bush out past the edge of the bed.

If I was going with a 4x4 that I could only grow one plant in comfortably in, I'd just get a 30-40 gallon container and use that. Would be a lot cheaper, and you could also move it around if you need to.

The other thing to consider, if you are going to have one plant per bed I'd rather have a 2x2 or a 3x3 with one plant each. A 4x4, in my opinion, is too big for one plant but not big enough for two comfortably.

But still if the optimum is one plant per bed I'd just get a container and forget all the labor and expense of building a bed.

Thank you for your input. I was going off what I researched from square foot gardening and a few other sources. But whatever I build, I have to rotate the next year with some other plant family. I don't keep tomatoes in the same place from year to year. I really think it would be a problem with all this mold/pests around here. I could do 3x3 though. I have always had 4x8 beds before, but I want to keep my tomato varieties separate from eachother. It seemed to me that some were perfectly healthy and strong whern the blight set in and then slowly the strong varieties would catch it from touching leaves. I am trying to avoid it again. I don't know the best way to grow tomatoes here. I just want to be able to GROW tomatoes here! lol I am open to anyone's suggestions on how to best prepare. My only need is that I can grow lots of different indeterminate heirlooms and have enough to can for the year. That's really all that matters to me. Now it's just a matter of doing it well.

[ChilliJez]

Lindsey

I can't speak for your particular circumstance and others are suggesting quite different numbers of plants for each raised bed.

Can I suggest that you pick, say, 3 of your 28 beds as trial beds? Pick 3 that you feel are most similar in wind exposure, shading etc and representative of your site.

If as an example you decide to plant 2 toms per bed throughout your 28 beds, then in fact plant 2 of whatever variety in the 25 and plant 1, 2, and 4 of the same variety in the 3 selected trial beds.

If that variety is medium vigour in the range of varieties you choose to grow you'll have a good idea of the best plan for your site next year. The key is to only change 1 variable. That could be the number of plants this year, pruning methods next, Absinthe vs Green Zebra the year after and so forth.

28 beds is such a fantastic opportunity to become the world's leading expert on your garden.

I do think that comparing what your best guess is with alternatives is the way forward. I hope you get control of your challenges.

Jeremy