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Old January 24, 2010   #46
Ambiorix
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Distribution of the seeds of blue tomatoes ended
There are seeds of 100 different blue tomatoes.

Ambiorix:25 (13 in common with the others and 12 tested only)
France:24
Belgium-( Ambiorix ) 19
Canada :14
England:5
Slovénia:4
Germany:3
Swiss:2
More than 1500 seeds were distributed in fact.
I would test for my part the seeds of 25 obtained different tomatoes.
Certain tests aim only at obtaining very blue plantations or darkened enough cotyledons.
Many persons are going to test this year the blue tomatoes stemming from my 3 seeds of the last year.

The first purpose is to put in culture an extraordinary variety in color.
The second purpose is to discover an even more extraordinary blue tomato parmis the harvest and to keep(guard) seeds.
The third purpose is to discover an extraordinarily blue plantation everywhere and to keep(guard) absolutely seeds.
The fourth purpose is to cross this blue tomato with another variety to obtain a magnificent blue tomato having some taste.
The fifth purpose is to introduce the blue color into the flesh.
Each will make that he can but will communicate his results with Ambiorix who will pass on them here so that each takes advantage of it.

2010 will be blue.
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Old January 26, 2010   #47
Fusion_power
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Here is an update for 2010 re plants I am growing.

In 2009, I grew about 70 F2 plants from a cross of P20 X Purple Haze F3. From these 70 plants, I selected 3 that had unique traits. 1 plant was RL with pink fruit with blue shoulders and about golf ball to a tad larger in size. 1 plant was PL with pink fruit and about golf ball to a tad larger in size. One plant was RL with 1 pound size fruit and moderate levels of anthocyanin.

I have about 40 seedlings growing with the following results:
the pink PL plant is giving seedlings that all express high levels of anthocyanin in the stems and leaves. There is some variation with a few plants that are darker than the rest. I suspect that the atv gene is homozygous and the aft gene is mixed with 1 in 4 plants expressing it fully.

The pink RL plant is showing a wide range of stem colors. Most likely, both atv and aft are mixed with very few plants fully expressing both genes.

The large fruited RL plant is showing very few plants with anthocyanin in the leaves and stems. I expect that only one of the genes made it into the parent plant.


So of the above, I have a lot of potential with the pink PL seedlings. Some of them are among the darkest plants I've yet grown with this background.

DarJones
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Old January 26, 2010   #48
Tom Wagner
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Ambiorix and I met in France and Belgium last September and we talked about the blue tomatoes and I agree that
2010 will be blue
!!!!!!

A number of folks would bring us some blue tomatoes and I showed those fruits during part of my tomato workshops in Europe. And since a few folks requested blue seed from me, I handed out some segregating lines for them to play around with.

Since DarJones, myself and others are playing around with F-2 F-3 populations there will be no shortage of blue tomatoes popping up all over the world. Just how the
atv and aft genes will manifest themselves is anybody's guess. I have not have not put a punnet square together with actual visuals or photos but I may this winter or summer. Combining the Woolly Green Zebra and OSU Blue has created quite a visual display in the greenhouse with a very few plants..extremely woolly and blue.

I believe I posted somewhere that the best way to get the bluest tomatoes will be to get the fruits down to 1/2 inch in diameter. The blue should be visible from the inside of the locule wall. These candidate plants will have to be rather sparse in foliage cover and have truss exposure to the sun.

Looks like this year I will have to grow thousands of seedling tomatoes just to select the 1:16 ratio of the bluest seedlings to go to the field or greenhouse. I wonder if there would be a way to get the Seattle Times to do a local contest looking for the bluest of the blue tomatoes?

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Old January 26, 2010   #49
travis
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Is the intent to get the most aesthetic or impressive looking fruit/plant or to incorporate the dietary benefits into a tomato that is fit for fresh eating? Because so far I see no indication that anyone has achieved the latter and it appears that some now are pursuing the former instead.
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Old January 26, 2010   #50
geoff1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travis View Post
Is the intent to get the most aesthetic or impressive looking fruit/plant or to incorporate the dietary benefits into a tomato that is fit for fresh eating? Because so far I see no indication that anyone has achieved the latter and it appears that some now are pursuing the former instead.
I am sure the intent is to select for all 3. I am selecting for a good large blue, with the dietary benefits, and thus far the taste is not too shabby either. Of course I have not the space to grow thousands of plants, so this is going to take quite a while.
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Old January 26, 2010   #51
travis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geoff1 View Post
I am selecting for a good large blue, with the dietary benefits, and thus far the taste is not too shabby either. Of course I have not the space to grow thousands of plants, so this is going to take quite a while.
What did you cross with go increase the size and flavor profile?
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Old January 27, 2010   #52
geoff1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travis View Post
What did you cross with go increase the size and flavor profile?
I believe the cross is with Purple Haze. I am only selecting from the progeny. I must give the credit for the cross itself to K.c. Tomato. It is a fun project for me.
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Old January 28, 2010   #53
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What is the epidermis color of OSU blue?
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Old January 28, 2010   #54
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The P20 from OSU is a red tomato with yellow skin but expresses anthocyinin wherever it is exposed to light. More light gives darker fruit.

I am selecting for a tomato that is both visually appealing and has decent flavor. I'd like to have knock-you-for-a-loop flavor, but that is a long shot with the genetics involved.

For this spring, I am growing 8 Sunlucky plants and a couple of the P20 PL pink plants with intent to do a few crosses. I'd love to get the flavor from Sunlucky into the blue tomato background. It may not be possible to do though, the genetics are extremely complex.

One huge benefit of the aft gene is that the tomatoes are virtually immune to sunscald.

DarJones
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Old January 28, 2010   #55
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Thank you DarJones.

What is Sunlucky?
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Old January 29, 2010   #56
lefty_logan
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From reading on another forum Keith Mueller is the breeder who created this cross.

I dont think OSU blue is available to a select few anymore because I, a 15 year old teenager with no connections, obtained seeds for this variety.
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Old January 29, 2010   #57
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I might have the real OSU blue because I received seeds from a member over at the other forum.
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Old January 29, 2010   #58
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I think the seed is pretty widely spread, which was not the intention of the originators, and unfortunate in some ways. That said, the genetics are not completely stable and selection at the seedling stage is still necessary.
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Old January 29, 2010   #59
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OSU Blue, which is commonly distributed at Seedsavers and can be found several places on the web, is an early version of the P20 selection. It does NOT give high levels of anthocyanin in the fruit. Look at any of the photos of it on the web and compare to this photo of the pure P20. The fruits in this photo are up to 2 inches diameter and about 2 weeks from ripening.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Bluetomato.jpg

P20 is an advanced selection from Jim Myers at OSU. It develops extremely dark fruit that can be so dark they are jet black. The stems and leaves also contain high levels of anthocyanin. Jim Myers has stated that he will release an official version this year that will combine the best traits they have been able to integrate to date. I am trying to get seed.

Jim made the genetics available about 4 years ago now via a non-propagation agreement. This means you can breed with it but you can't sell the original seed/plants. I got an early start of the seed and have been working with it to develop highly colored fruit with improved flavor. The first year I grew the plants I got a range of plant and fruit colors from barely darkened fruit to one plant that produced jet black tomatoes. I have been saving seed from the jet black line ever since.

At least 50 other growers also got seed from Jim over the last few years and have been crossing and selecting to get larger fruit with better flavor. I expect that within 2 years blue tomatoes will be commonly available and no longer much of a conversation item.

DarJones
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Old January 30, 2010   #60
Tom Wagner
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Getting larger blue/black fruit won't increase your intake of the anthocyanin, but a tiny blue/black fruit will. Since the blue is sunlight mediated, a tiny cherry tomato hanging down with near full exposure is the ticket. The maximum surface area to volume of fruit is the math required. I am trying to put all the formulas together.......anthocyanin content per ounce at a heightened level is the important thing for health benefits, not just beauty or size. To calculate the surface area of a sphere use the formula -

4pr2

r being the radius of the sphere.
and 'p' being pi 3.14
I need to measure the blue exactly in the skin/pericarp and compile some % of the flesh that is blue to the % not blue. Any math genius types out there?

Besides the blue/black skin appearing appealing on a red fleshed tomato, my breeding with P-20 with segregations this year to get blue/black on gold, yellow, brown, pink, green, bicolor, stripes, odd shapes is where lots of potential will mushroom.

Is there any communication with Jim Myers on his name for the release?

Tom Wagner...black and blue results this year will be due...
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