Captain Lucky - YUMM - and F6-7?

[tam91]

I got mine from Suze. I only sowed two seeds (my bad) but I got one potato leaf and one regular leaf. I kept the potato leaf.

I don't know if Suze bags her seeds - hopefully, what I have is really Captain Lucky, and there is just some variation in color. I know whatever it is, it's gorgeous and the taste is really outstanding.

Most importantly, I hope Suze is ok just now. Hopefully, she is fine, and will be back to comment on this thread.

[nctomatoman]

One question - I assume that Captain Lucky is an offspring of Lucky Cross? If so, that was a very, very wide cross and probably even more complex than just a two way - Tad wasn't stable when it crossed with Brandywine, and the presence of heart shape indicates to me that another nearby variety, Anna Russian (heart shaped) may be involved as well.

So Lucky Cross and Little Lucky have both been a bit stubborn to get 95% reliable - and it could be that this extreme variability carries through to Captain Lucky.

If, however, C. L. is not a Lucky Cross offspring, please disregard - too lazy this morning to go and search for Cap. Lucky info!

[fortyonenorth]

You're right, Craig. According to Millard's listing in the SSE Yearbook, Captain Lucky is an "accidental cross between Lucky Cross and an unknown variety..."

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by tam91

Oh Carolyn.... paging Carolyn...

(I bet she knows the answer)

Tam, please read the link offered by 41 north which is from the Seed Exchange here and look at the last post made by Winterfly.

I have seen pisctures of fruits for this variety at other message sites, one in particular, and it would appear that it depends on when you got your seeds and from whom and yes, folks are showing pictures of what Captain Lucky should NOT be.

Hopefully it will get stabilized in the future so that wrong seeds are not offered or traded for those who do not have what is true Captain Lucky.

[tam91]

Thank you Carolyn - I did read that thread, very interesting. But I got my seeds from Suze, so Winterfly's problem shouldn't apply to me I don't believe.

I think (please correct me if I'm wrong) that my fruits seem to be basically correct - just a bit redder. So I was guessing that (perhaps?) I have the right thing, just some variability. Do you disagree?

I'm also wondering if I should grow the seeds I saved next year, or go back to the remaining two or three that I have from Suze. Any opinions?

Although honestly - I think I will grow out my seeds anyway - even if it's "wrong" they are really really delicious. If they are wrong though, I guess I'd try again with Suze's seeds also, or....?

Edit: I do want to make sure that what I have is the real thing, in case I eventually have enough to share.

[nctomatoman]

Ah, the tricky part of a variety that is still a bit unstable (if that is what's happening)...what indeed is the real thing! If a yet to be stabilized variety is named, it is just a snapshot in time and development!

Makes this all rather fun...and confusing! Welcome to what we grapple with regularly in the Dwarf project!

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by tam91

Thank you Carolyn - I did read that thread, very interesting. But I got my seeds from Suze, so Winterfly's problem shouldn't apply to me I don't believe.

I think (please correct me if I'm wrong) that my fruits seem to be basically correct - just a bit redder. So I was guessing that (perhaps?) I have the right thing, just some variability. Do you disagree?

I'm also wondering if I should grow the seeds I saved next year, or go back to the remaining two or three that I have from Suze. Any opinions?

Although honestly - I think I will grow out my seeds anyway - even if it's "wrong" they are really really delicious. If they are wrong though, I guess I'd try again with Suze's seeds also, or....?

Edit: I do want to make sure that what I have is the real thing, in case I eventually have enough to share.

Tam, I can't agree or disagree with what you might have b'c I haven't grown Captain Lucky myself.

I can only look at pictures where folks claim what they have is Captain Lucky and then look at pictures from others who have grown it and say what's shown isn't true Captain Lucky.

http://idigmygarden.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47687

Above is a very long thread at idig that I think illustrates my point quite well. More pictures for you and anyone else to look at and more examples of true and not true Captain Lucky.

[kath]

Originally Posted by fortyonenorth

In this thread http://www.tomatoville.com/showthrea...t=17386&page=2 Winterfly says that his results were dramatically (not subtly) different that what was expected, leading him to suspect a cross.

Did you get seeds from me, Kath? The reason I ask is that I had two packets - one from Winterfly and one from Suze. I still have the packet from Suze, so I must have sent you all or some of the seed from Winterfly. I can't remember if his seed was from 2009 or 2010 - you might want to check to see if I noted. If it's 2010, I suppose it might be questionable.

Affirmative- checked the packet and the year isn't noted, but since it's F6, I assume it's the 2010 batch.

With all opinions considered, it sounds highly likely that a cross may have occurred, so trying to repeat for this reddish fruit sounds pretty risky. The neighbor found lots of varieties she liked, so it may be a non-issue for her. Personally, I plan to use the 2011 seed and hope for the true Captain Lucky as this tomato wasn't high enough on my list to be a repeat anyway.

Reading the responses was very interesting- thanks to those who posted.

[tam91]

Well the mystery continues.

I'd say mine are not as red as the "wrong" one at that last thread - they are more multi-colored, with more green. But more red than some of the other photos certainly.

I'll have to get some good photos when I slice the next few, and see what I have - the Captain Lucky experts who've developed/grown the thing can hopefully weigh in.

[tam91]

After slicing (and eating - yumm!) another Captain Lucky, I think that I probably do have the correct one. It isn't as red as my photo appears, the green is predominant, and the tomato was very ripe. So unless someone think I'm incorrect, I'm thinking I did indeed get "lucky".

[winterfly]

The intrigue continues about Captain Lucky. Here's what I think happened. In my garden in 2009, my Captain Lucky variety, which is potato leafed, crossed with a variety that was also potato leafed and of a color recessive to the color of Captain Lucky (probably my Potato leafed variety Ahab), which yielded an F1 similar in appearance to Captain Lucky. Seeds saved from this F1 cross are the seeds I distributed in 2010. I grew 5 of these F2 seeds this year and got one white, three black, and one tricolor. Most of those that grew out the seeds I distributed reported black fruit. I sent seeds of Captain Lucky to Suze in 2009, and those seeds seem to have been the true uncrossed Captain Lucky seeds.

Lurley is one person that grew seeds he had obtained from Suze and he was kind enough to send me seeds, enough for 12 packs. I am going to use those seeds to replace the seeds I distributed this year taken from the F2 tricolor fruit mentioned above, which I now think is not the true Captain Lucky variety, although they are similar in color. Lurley has offered to send me more seeds, and if he does, I'll try to replace those seeds I distributed in 2010 via SSE or give-a-ways, but I'll have to rely on forum postings because I didn't keep a record of who I sent them to.
The original Captain Lucky seems to be a good enough variety to go to this much trouble to keep the variety pure. If someone has any other ideas, then please let me know.

[tam91]

I also grew the seeds I got from Suze, and as near as I can tell, mine is the real thing.

I'd love to help preserve this variety - unfortunately, I only got one bagged fruit, and not a lot of seeds from that one. I have to germination test them also, as those seeds like a bit small to me. Fingers crossed.

I have one unbagged fruit now, and perhaps a few more will ripen. I can try to get a few more seeds, but if we're really worried about keeping the variety true, this probably isn't the best idea. It was at the south end of the row, and it was the westernmost row, but my plants are very close. Let me know what you think.

I wish I had enough to share, but I only have a few. I will try to grow several of these plants next year, maybe even in isolation, and try to get plenty of seeds.

I think it is an amazing variety - probably my favorite this year. Beautiful and incredibly tasty, perhaps a rare combination.

[winterfly]

Thanks for the thought. I believe it's worth every effort to try to keep true Captain Lucky seeds circulating. Thanks for your comments.

[Suze]

Tracy, I had a ton of other things on my plate around the time you started this thread and never got around to replying until now. Sorry 'bout that. Have you had a chance to take any other pictures since that first one of CL, maybe of ones that were not so ripe? That might help clear some things up, perhaps.

I do think the tomatoes in your photo looked just a little on the dark side for Cap'n - however - at least in my climate/growing conditions for the last two years, if CL fruits were allowed to become very ripe, I did frequently see a significant amount of pink-black* coloration both on the exterior (esp toward the bottom) and also inside when sliced. *pink-black referring to the darker coloration as Cap'n does/should have a clear epidermis. Edit/add - I don't think I took any photos of any very ripe CL tomatoes, but yes, they can potentially get quite a bit darker than the pic I've posted here before of them when the fruits were -just- ripe.

I'll also add that if I allow red-gold or pink-yellow bicolors to get very ripe, they frequently turn mostly red or pink. For me at least, warmer weather seems to cause the pink, red, or dark (depending on the variety) colors of bicolors and tricolors to express more. Or that matter, a variety of other weather or growing conditions I've honestly not quite nailed down yet can sometimes do that as well.

[Aubergine]

I have seeds of Captain Lucky from exchange with a french man and as I read here about taste, I think, I must grow it next year