Pea strategies

[OneDahlia]

Most of the posts in Legumes are about beans ... can we talk peas?

I want to grow lots and lots of peas this spring. Snow peas, snap peas, shelling peas. My two kids will eat all peas they can fit in their stomachs on sight, and I want to have enough to eat plenty myself too. And I would really like to have lots of shelling peas to freeze.

I've never grown peas before. I'm trying to figure out how much space I need to plant in peas to get this kind of harvest, and where I can find that space, and how to handle them for the best chance of success.

So ...

How many peas do you plant? (Ie, how many seeds or how large a space/how long a row?) Please specify for each kind (snow, snap, shelling).

What kind of harvest do you get from that plot?

When do you plant them? And when are you usually pulling them out? (Especially if you're in zone 7a, northern Virginia. Some things I've read seem to indicate I could be planting them here now, but others seem to plant quite a bit later.)

How do you make the best use of your garden space re: planting peas? Ie, do you plant them on the edge of a bed used for something else, or do you plant something after them?

Do you direct sow them? If so, do you presoak, sprout, or just sow?

Do you plant different kinds near each other? Any issues with crossing?

Have you had any success planting them in less than full sun? (I'm hoping to tuck some into shadier edges of the garden.)

Can you give feedback on specific varieties you've tried?

Anything I forgot?

Thanks!

[kath]

OneDahlia-

I've always planted peas here in 6b by about March 17th- earlier depending upon the weather in that year- I grow the best, earliest varieties I can find because we love to eat them raw, cooked and frozen but we also love the sweet corn that will follow the peas in succession. If I didn't prepare the area in fall, I wouldn't be able to do this because the ground is usually too wet to work at that time of the year here. I add amendments and work the ground in fall and make raised narrow rows that are flat on top and about 10" wide and the length of the row- which has varied because I have changed the garden around a lot each year since we've moved here. This year I have 5 rows 20' long- I try to leave at least 3' between rows if possible, because they will billow out when full size and you need enough room to get on both sides of the row to harvest. I wish I had room for more and hope I will soon when I no longer feel compelled to grow insane numbers of tomatoes. In the fall, we cover the whole thing with shredded leaves for the winter. When the time is right in the spring, all that needs to be done is to innoculate the seed and poke it into the rows (I don't soak them), erect the posts and support fencing and wait for them to emerge. I'm not above covering the whole plot with plastic if the soil needs warming in the late winter and/or to prevent too much rain from making the area soggier than I'd like. Peas are pretty hardy even when they've emerged, but if the soil is heavy and too wet and cold for an extended time, you will notice poor emergence due to rotting of the seed.

I can't give specifics about how much to expect to get from a row of a particular type to fulfill your family's needs. Spring has been a fairly good producer the times we've grown it as was Dakota and Premium and we had better luck with these than with Lincoln, Green Arrow and the other older types. I also don't really have shady areas to contend with, so no help there.

We're not big on snow peas and don't grow them anymore but did have good luck with Oregon Giant. DH has taken to Sugar Lace II, a sugar snap type, so I'm growing them again this year. You will get A LOT more edible poundage from either of these types of peas than you will from shell peas- I only plant a few feet of either of these at a time and we still give some away because I only freeze the shell peas.

We eat peas every day from when they start coming in until they're pulled- usually for about 6 weeks or more. I like them gone by July 4th because I can't plant corn much later than that here.
I've never saved seed because I'm not willing to let them hang on the vine long enough to dry but I always buy the tried and true ones in bulk. New varieties I'll plant whatever is in the small packet if I want to gamble with that much space. The seed packets tell you how many row ft. they will plant. I plant peas in double rows about 6" apart and place the seeds about 1 1/2" apart in each row- never thin and try to mulch lightly to reduce weeds rather than hoe as the roots are shallow. The fencing is placed 6-8" above the ground and centered between the double rows with posts every 8' or so. As the peas grow, I will run cord along and attach to the end posts on both sides to help the plants attach and avoid too much billowing later.

You can definitely plant them along the northern edges of beds that will be taken over by vines or will be planted to fall brassicas, lettuce, spinach or another later crop. Most things like to be planted where peas have grown because of their ability to fix nitrogen in the soil. They are delicious and fun to grow but the shell peas are very labor intensive to pick and shell- if your children like to do this you are truly blessed!

Let me know if there's anything else I forgot-

Kath

[delltraveller]

You forgot to mention the rabbits, Kath. Rabbits love those yummy pea plants starting to grow, so if you don't have a canine or feline with a strong prey drive to keep them on the run, you'll want to provide some protection. Around here 24" high chicken wire does the trick. Make sure the bottom edge is pinned to the ground or buried slightly or they'll slip underneath.

[janezee]

omg, that's a lot of ???
I love peas. Not like, love. The best part of living here is that I can grow peas about 6 months of the year, with planning. YMMV, and that's a probable. So, you'll want to get as much out of your garden as possible in as short a time as you can. Good news is that you can grow 2 crops, spring and fall. And you can do them two ways: plant all at once, with early, mid, and late maturing peas, or plant every 3 weeks for continuing harvest.

I like to plant peas everywhere, all the time. I'm growing short, medium, and pole peas, too.

If you want real quantity, though, you want sugar snap peas. Sweetest, and productive over a long time, and the most product per vine. I find shelling peas to take up too much space for the amount you get, and they're way more work. Ugh. Of course, there is one exception to the rule--I grow petite pois just for fresh eating, and only for myself. They never make it to the house. I once dreamt that I could grow enough to freeze. Ha!

Sugar Sprint and Sugar Ann are my current favorites, but I'm trialing Cascadia, Sugar Daddy, Super Sugar Snap, Golden India, Mangetout Carouby, and a purple podded snap this year. For snow peas, the Dwarf Gray and Oregon Snow are good, but once you've tried snap peas, it's hard to love the others as much.
Peas can tolerate some shade, especially if it gets hot quickly where you live. My own opinion is that it's hot nights that lead to peas giving up the ghost, though, which is why they go all summer here most years. Our nights seldom stay above 60, and almost never above 70.

As to spacing, I plant mine in raised beds, behind my tomatoes, in a 12" row, with a trellis down the middle, with the peas 4" apart. That's 16 peas per square foot. The secret is make them grow up, not out.

I plant them with Mykos, which is much less expensive than innoculant, but when I'm flush, I use that, too. I'm planting 4 squares of Cascadia this afternoon, as soon as I'm done here, because you have me all fired up and it's 55 and sunny here. I'll plant again, in about two weeks, so I can see if there's an advantage to planting this early. I hope we don't get hit like Europe, after all this warm weather.

Gotta go! Hope this helps.
jane

[OneDahlia]

Kath, thanks for all that info! I wasn't picturing them fluffing out that much ... I may need to rethink some places I thought I might squeeze some in. 100 feet of peas, wow! That's mostly shelling peas, if I understood you right? And yes, for now, my children think it's fun to pick and shell peas and beans -- we'll see what they think by the end of this summer if I manage to grow as many as I hope.

[kath]

Originally Posted by delltraveller

You forgot to mention the rabbits, Kath. Rabbits love those yummy pea plants starting to grow, so if you don't have a canine or feline with a strong prey drive to keep them on the run, you'll want to provide some protection. Around here 24" high chicken wire does the trick. Make sure the bottom edge is pinned to the ground or buried slightly or they'll slip underneath.

Oh, yeah- good point- I just assume everybody has a wire fence around a garden- if we didn't, I wouldn't be able to grow a thing! Deer, rabbits, groundhogs, raccoons, etc....
As it is, with the peas, I have to cover the hills with long tunnels of chicken wire until the plants are a few inches tall or the crows will find them and dig them all out when they start to germinate! I don't erect the fencing until then or the wire tunnels wouldn't work.

[Jeannine Anne]

This is going to be a big pea year for me, I soent a lot of time buying and swapping varieties last year for this project and have a lot of varieties mostly old heirloom ones.

I think I am only going to plant the tall growing ones not anybush ones .

I am not so keen on snap or snow ones although I have some really big ones I may try.

I am stating peas anytime now here, my biggest problem is the mice eating the seed before it sprouts.

Curious to know what varieties folks are growing.

Also I am growing a few grown for dried peas like Irish Preens and a few soup peas. I am really looking forward to year of the pea..

Champion of England is one that grows atll that is a great producer.

l can't helpwith harvest amounts as peas have never been anything I really took much notice of in previous year and I just grew what was around locally. And planting times would be differnt I think, but ball park they can go in as soon as the ground can be worked as long as it isn't soaking wet or they will rot.. Innoculant is a good idea

I am hoping for a huge intersting harvest this year, good luck to yout oo.

XX Jeannine

[kath]

Originally Posted by OneDahlia

Kath, thanks for all that info! I wasn't picturing them fluffing out that much ... I may need to rethink some places I thought I might squeeze some in. 100 feet of peas, wow! That's mostly shelling peas, if I understood you right? And yes, for now, my children think it's fun to pick and shell peas and beans -- we'll see what they think by the end of this summer if I manage to grow as many as I hope.

The billowing doesn't tend to happen until they are 2 1/2-3' tall- it's windy here and I use chicken wire for fencing. With the weight of the peas, the rows of peas can move toward one another so much that they start intertwining with the vines of adjacent rows if not given enough room.

There are taller varieties you could grow that could give you a better yield with less row feet perhaps and if you have a sturdier support for those, like cattle panel or something, they still could fit in well on the edge somewhere I think.

Yes, mostly shell peas. I grew about the same amount of row feet last year and only froze about a half dozen quarts but we eat peas every day in the season, and lots of them. DH loves to shell. Some people are able to get a smaller crop of peas by planting for the fall, but I've not had success trying to start them in the heat. Maybe your shadier area would enable you to do something like that. Freezing snap peas would give you more meals for the amount of space, too. I've never tried growing them in fall.

[OneDahlia]

Lol, Janezee, thanks for attacking my questions too. Mmm, peas for 6 months. That's a good idea to plant early, mid and late-maturing peas -- I hadn't thought of that. Happy planting!

Dell, yeah, I guess it's time to put up that fence. I've been bugging my husband to help me put one up since last summer, when a groundhog showed up one night and ate every single one of my tomatoes, which were just beginning to blush. Hopefully this weekend.

Jeannine, that should be fun to see the results of all those different kinds. I look forward to reading about them.

Kath, you said:

As it is, with the peas, I have to cover the hills with long tunnels of chicken wire until the plants are a few inches tall or the crows will find them and dig them all out when they start to germinate! I don't erect the fencing until then or the wire tunnels wouldn't work.

I don't understand why you can't put up the fencing until then or the tunnels wouldn't work -- can you explain more?

[kath]

Originally Posted by Jeannine Anne

Curious to know what varieties folks are growing.

XX Jeannine

This year I am growing lots of Spring, which grows about 4' tall for me but it's early and not too bushy. It's easy to see for picking, it's nice and sweet and was an ok freezer. I'm also trying Coral, Karina and Penelope this year in small amounts.

Last year we tried Early Frosty, Patriot, Burpeanna Early, Green Arrow (again) and Mayfair but found no keepers. Spring here is unpredictable- when it is cold and wet, pea disease is a problem; when we get an early heat wave the vines suffer, too. None of these wowed us with taste, production, etc.

Over the years, we've tried Lincoln, Knight, Strike, Little Marvel, Mr. Big, Alderman (Tall Telephone), Maestro, Dakota, Century, Pioneer, Eclipse, Alaska, Premium, Giant Burpeanna, Burpeanna, Sugar Lace, Novella, Knight, Sugar Sprint, Dwarf White Sugar, Snow Bird, Oregon Trail, Oregon Sugar Pod II, Super Sugar Snap and Sugar Ann.

The best ones we've found for our area and taste buds include Spring, Premium and Dakota for shell peas; and Sugar Sprint and Sugar Lace II for edible podded type.

[kath]

OneDahlia:
"I don't understand why you can't put up the fencing until then or the tunnels wouldn't work -- can you explain more?"

What I mean is that when I put the seed into the ground, I have to wait to erect the support fencing for the peas. You could put up the fence posts at the ends of the rows, just not the support posts along the rows or the chicken wire. The tunnels I use wouldn't fit down over the metal t-posts that I use for support posts for the fencing. The chicken wire tunnels are only between 12-18" high.

[Fusion_power]

Try some Yakumo (or Yokomo) Giant snowpeas.

DarJones

[tgplp]

Here is what I grew last year:

Shelling peas:
Green Arrow (it was ok, nothing special)
Blondie (OMG I love this pea best pea ever! You already heard all I have to say about it in my post with all the pictures of my garden last year, so I won't talk much about it here. )
Early Frosty (I didn't get a harvest from this one; I grew it in my hoophouse and it got some sort of fungal disease.)

Snow peas:
Dwarf Grey Sugar (This is a tasty snow pea, it's a dwarf, but the my favorite thing about it is its beautiful pinky purple flowers! Also, one of my earliest peas.)
Oregon Giant (not a giant, in fact this was the smallest pea plant I had.... huh. Maybe I got the wrong seeds?)


Sugar Snap peas:
Sugar Snap (this is just the plain old traditional sugar snap pea. And it is my favorite out of all the snow peas and sugar snap peas! The pods are crunchy, juicy, sweet, and plain delicious. Healthy productive plants, too.)

Super Sugar Snap (basically like Sugar Snap, only less productive for me. Which is funny, because it is supposed to be more productive! I probably won't grow again; I'll just grow extra Sugar Snap peas.)



Ok! Now I'll talk about how I support my peas. I usually grow them in the middle of my tomato patch. I put two rebar stakes (about five or six feet tall) in the ground, eight feet apart. Then I stretch garden netting between the two stakes, and tie the netting. (I use the Gardener's Supply Company Nearly Invisible Netting). Then I plant the pea seeds an inch apart on either side of the net. Cover with dirt, water about once a week (we get lots of rain here) and wallah! Peas.

This year, I want to try a fun pea structure that I read about in a gardening book. You find some branches, stick 'em in the ground, plant a couple dwarf pea seeds around the branch, and the pea plants grow up the branch. It is very decorative and pretty looking. It's called pea brush. Here is a great blog post with pictures and info about pea brush:
http://veggiegardenblog.blogspot.com...rush-post.html

Last year, in my hoophouse, I tried another way of supporting the peas. I just planting dwarf pea seeds extremely close to each other, and when the peas grew they supported each other. unfortunately, they grew into an extremely wet, tangled, disease ridden mass. I will not try that again!


I usually keep about three plants per pea variety, and this keeps my family of four with plenty of peas all late spring and early summer! Mmmmm I can't wait til pea season! I usually plant pea seeds sometime in March.

Taryn

[Petronius_II]

Snow peas are my favorite, and I've gotten good results with Oregon Sugar Pod II and Mammoth Melting Sugar.

I prefer MMS because it's more heat-tolerant and will produce more over a longer season. However, MMS can easily grow to 4 or 5 feet and maybe more given the opportunity, so a trellis is almost mandatory.

For saving horizontal space, tall varieties that need a trellis are theoretically ideal, but Alderman aka Tall Telephone has never performed well for me, and died off early one year from what appeared to be fusarium wilt; meanwhile I got a somewhat meager crop from whatever pea I planted next to it, despite the wilt.

The original Sugar Snap is still a top-performing snap pea and a perennial favorite among children especially. Super Sugar Snap is said to be even better, can't say from experience. Both also can use a trellis of some kind.

I do advise saving seed. Save only from the last 1/4 or 1/3 or so of your specimens, the ones that are still producing after spring/summer heat has shut the others down, keep doing that every year, and sooner or later somebody's going to come up with a pea that could've withstood last summer's scorcher of a heat wave. I do think Mammoth Melting Sugar has a lot of potential to become the most heat-resistant pea ever. Willhite's has it for $4.50 a pound, probably a Texas strain which might be pretty heat-resistant to begin with.

The only shelling pea I've ever grown is Wando, well known as the most heat-resistant shelling pea and the only one most Albuquerqueans grow. Grows to about 3 feet and can benefit from being trellised but doesn't require it. I grew mine on a fence that got partial shade during the hottest part of the day, and it performed very well.

[Jeannine Anne]

Thank you for sharing your varieties. this will be my first year after coming back to BC that I have done peas apart from a few so I am not sure which will do well here. Mostly ine are from the Uk which is very similar weather to my part of BC. I couldn't find many tall growing ones for sale here.

I have
Douce Provence
Champion of England
Magnum Bowman
Robinson
Ostgotaart
Kools Langstro Rosyn Erwt
Simpsons Special
Telephone
Mr Bounds Pea Bean
Purple Podded
Irish Preens
Serpette Guilloteau
Duke of Albany
Collosal
Jeyes
Wieringer Witte
Blauwschokker
Ne Plus Ultra
Alderman
Harold Idle
Lancashire Lass(purple version of Lancashire Lad)
Table Talk

I am hoping to get and keep seeds from the above so I can be more selective next year.

I also have Mr Big but seem to be hearing conflicting ideas about wether it is a pole or bush type so need help on that one.

I then have some snap and snow but not planning on growing them this year, I don't think

I do have some bush ones ,I may pop in a few as earlies.

Little Marvel
D'Annonay
Early Onward
Vada
Waverex
Half Pint
Lincoln
Parsley
Hurst Green Shaft
Early Alaskan

I would be most obliged if anyone has any info on the above varieties as most are completely new to me.

XX Jeannine