Member discussion regarding the methods, varieties and merits of growing tomatoes.
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March 11, 2009 | #31 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 630
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Yeah, I did a little research and I believe they do have a GMO tomato, although I'm not sure whether they have marketed it. Its possibly in the developmental stage.
During the 90s a company called Calgene sold a GMO tomato called Flavr Savr. Apparently the tomato was sold mostly in California and a few places in the midwest. The tomato flopped because the flavor was bland and the variety was susceptible to disease in the humid climate in which it was cultivated. Monsanto claimed that Calgene was guilty of patent infringement (leading me to believe they had already been working on such an animal) and ended up buying them out. So at this point in time there may not be any GMO tomatoes being sold in the U.S. - and if they aren't sold here they're probably not sold anywhere. The Europeans certainly won't buy them. |
March 11, 2009 | #32 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 1,818
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As grain farmers, we have had many dealings with Monsanto. It's not pretty, and they are SO BIG. If you knew how many tactics they have implemented to force their way into controlling the market on grain, I think you'd be sick.
We have been fighting them for years. They are a cancer that we can't get rid of.
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Barbee |
March 11, 2009 | #33 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: western Colorado zone 5
Posts: 307
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Organichris, If any one bought the tomatoes the seeds could have been saved. I do not think they market it any now. Going to the bigger crops of corn and wheat and soy beans I think for the money. I bought a pint of small red plum like tomatoes at the store. Only ones I guess I have bought in good many years. They tasted terrible. Seeded them as going to try growing a few and see if any better. Size I have not seen in seed cats. I really do not think any chance of getting GMO seeds. I do not want any.
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March 11, 2009 | #34 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: West Virginia - Zone 6
Posts: 594
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Unless I'm missing something or not reading it properly farms, farmer's markets, gardens, and many other entities are excluded. I've included the text below:
(B) EXCLUSIONS- For the purposes of registration, the term ‘food establishment’ does not include a food production facility as defined in paragraph (14), restaurant, other retail food establishment, nonprofit food establishment in which food is prepared for or served directly to the consumer, or fishing vessel (other than a fishing vessel engaged in processing, as that term is defined in section 123.3 of title 21, Code of Federal Regulations). (14) FOOD PRODUCTION FACILITY- The term ‘food production facility’ means any farm, ranch, orchard, vineyard, aquaculture facility, or confined animal-feeding operation. Also, an unverified source told me that Ms. DeLauro has attempted to introduce this bill into previous Congresses. Let's hope the feds address issues that led to the peanut and other recent food scare situations correctly. I know they aren't bright (DC politicians) but I think they're smart enough to know that in difficult economic times people are going to resort more and more to growing their own food etc. There seems to be a lot of hype about this. I'm not going to get sucked up into the hype but instead will try to form a rational and intelligent opinion. Good luck. Randy |
March 11, 2009 | #35 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 630
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Quote:
But from the text you quoted we can infer that, "For the purposes of registration, the term `food establishment' does not include a food production facility as defined in paragraph (14)..." But let's not forget to read the remainder of the sentence: (cont)"...restaurant, other retail food establishment, nonprofit food establishment in which food is prepared for or served directly to the consumer..." So then, this exemption only applies when the food is sold from the farm without storing or transporting it. You know, like farms that allow you to pick your own pumpkins or greens or whatever. Now read paragraph (9): (9) CATEGORY 5 FOOD ESTABLISHMENT- The term `category 5 food establishment' means a food establishment that stores, holds, or transports food products prior to delivery for retail sale. |
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March 11, 2009 | #36 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Indiana
Posts: 76
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Organic - you are so correct about reading all the details - once also has to remeber that these are written in legal language. A good blacks legal dictionary will help.
the Terms "Shall" and "May" have different meanings when applied to the government or companies, or individuals in each case. Quote:
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March 11, 2009 | #37 | ||
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: West Virginia - Zone 6
Posts: 594
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Quote:
The following are exempt from registration: - a food production facility as defined in paragraph (14) - restaurants - other retail food establishments - nonprofit food establishments in which food is prepared for or served directly to the consumer - fishing vessel (other than a fishing vessel engaged in processing, as that term is defined in section 123.3 of title 21, Code of Federal Regulations). Is that contradictory to the way you're looking at it? Quote:
I think this bill is seriously flawed. I think people are getting worked up about nothing. Randy edit: added the words seriously and think. |
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March 11, 2009 | #38 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Tulsa, OK
Posts: 630
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Quote:
I also understand the peanut scare and like incidents are the cover story for the legislation, but that doesn't mean that is the primary thrust behind the bill(s). Even if that were the case, there are all these other ulterior interests that may be served. The ties the sponsor has to Monsanto only add to my suspicions of the influence of the big agribusiness lobby. We must remember that policies get implemented based on this equation: Problem - Reaction - Solution. When a problem arises (in this case food poisoning) there is a reaction from the public, usually demanding action on the part of the government. The government comes up with a solution to satisfy the demands of the populace. As long as "something is done" it usually satisfies the concerns of the public, but that doesn't mean that the solution does not include measures unrelated to the cover story for the legislation. In fact, whether the issue is health care, national security, or whatever, there are always corporations looking to manipulate the situation for their own benefit. Is health care a legitimate concern? Sure, if you're going to survive, but that doesn't mean we need laws written by and for the pharmaceutical industry. |
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March 11, 2009 | #39 |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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I'm late to this thread and need to go back and read more carefully but there are NO genetically modified tomatoes around. There used to be as was noted above, Favr Savr, and the other one was Endless Summer. It sure was. Several fruits sat on my counter in the kitchen for at least FOUR months and looked the same after four months as they did the day I bought them, out of curiousity.
Here's a link to the history of Seminis so we can keep things straight here: http://www.seminis.com/about/history.asp Seminis itself is a conglomeration of companies accumulated over time as you can see, and while many folks just assumed that Monsanto would force production of GMO tomato varieties I never did. They made a very astute decision to buy Seminis b'c the price was right, aka, a way to make money on an investment. Stupid they aren't. Monsanto and Syngenta own the GMO grains, corns, soybean, etc market and they know what happened to the abortive efforts to introduce GMO tomatoes. I could say more but politics aren't permitted here at Tville, so I won't. And the last thing I want to see is a foray into Monsanto, Syngenta, etc,, as corporate entities. You can go post at idig where there's a whole Forum devoted to the politics of food.
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Carolyn |
March 11, 2009 | #40 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 5,346
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Idig is a dump, and with questionable, uneven moderation. Wrong information is allowed to stand if it is put up by favorite posters.
So far I find the discussion in this thread to be quite useful.
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[SIZE="3"]I've relaunched my gardening website -- [B]TheUnconventionalTomato.com[/B][/SIZE] * [I][SIZE="1"]*I'm not allowed to post weblinks so you'll have to copy-paste it manually.[/SIZE][/I] |
March 12, 2009 | #41 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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Quote:
I was only pointing out that there is a Forum at idig titled the Politics of Food where anything goes, as to political talk re specific parties and people and that isn't allowed here. And yes, some very questionable threads/posts are made there. I looked at it just once b/c I was curious and never went back to read again.
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Carolyn |
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March 12, 2009 | #42 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: western Colorado zone 5
Posts: 307
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I sure hope it does not include us little growers .
Yes, I do know that the legal speak is hard to read. I had a guy come in where I worked and talking hunting and new rules. I had read them . He said he had to buy a hard case for his gun. I told him did not say hard case only encased and unloaded totally. I need figure out if hauling tomatoes to my son's place or market to sell would be transporting then. ? There is a fruit and veggies stand in town they haul in their stuff to sell. I am not sure how they get it. I may be compostinga lot of veggies yet. Thanks, Carolyn, I was pretty sure Seminis was part of Monsanto. I do not worry about getting any GMO seed. Better Boy is a tougher tomato and seems to with stands the flea hoppers better if they come. Or the flea hoppers don't like as well as other tomatoes. They seem to love Romas the best. |
March 12, 2009 | #43 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Zone 4 NY
Posts: 772
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I know people often donate their surplus tomatoes to food banks or senior citizen homes and such. If you transport vegetables to such places would that be against this law?
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March 12, 2009 | #44 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: West Virginia - Zone 6
Posts: 594
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Quote:
What makes you think it is good company? Sorry, just my sense of humor, please take that in the jesting manner in which it was intended. I will say this, there are a lot of you. I suspect one person's misinterpretations got a lot of people spun up. I think the exemptions exclude home gardens, small farms, farmer's markets, roadside stands, etc. and you don't. Until we get verification we'll have to agree to disagree. Moving on, one of the things that caused me to question all of this was the statement "Effectively criminalizes organic farming..." in conjuntion with a list of elected officials supporting HR 875. That list includes co-sponsor Peter DeFazio. So, let me get this straight the person who introduced the bill to create organic foods (Peter DeFazio) and worked hard to get it through when the USDA tried to mess it up is now co-sponsoring a bill that criminalizes organic farming? Also DeFazio is quoted as saying, "...I will continue to push for more reforms so farm aid is targeted to small farmers..." That individual is now co-sponsoring a bill that is "criminalizing small farms"? Of course I realize politicians flip-flop, but that doesn't seem right to me. Actually, I request those of you who have representatives on the aforementioned list to contact them and get clarification or if you have lawyer connections get an intepretation from them. I've stated my suspicions and if I'm correct you could be asking your representatives not to vote on a bill when that actually might not be your intent. And if some one does get clarification please post it here. Randy p.s. My intent is not to pick on you organichris please understand that. |
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March 12, 2009 | #45 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: West Virginia - Zone 6
Posts: 594
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Colorado west and lumierefrere:
I don't think it applies to any of your stated scenarios. Others have a different opinion. Good luck. Randy |
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