Special Soil Mix

[TomatoDon]

Tomatophiles:

As you many of you know I plant in raised beds with a good soil mix. Even then I dig a nice, large hole, usually 18 x 18," (going into the natural ground) and fill it with a good blend of "soil-less" soil, green sand, and a teaspoon of Miracle Grow sprinkled in.

I keep hearing about eggshells and Epsom salts to prevent BER (Carolyn I'm learning the lingo) on these forums. Do any of you use that in the planting hole as well?

I know BER is related to both nutrients and watering. What is the best thing to add at planting time to insure the proper nutrients, season long, to prevent BER?

Also...Mr. Tomato LTD (http://www.mrtomato.com/) in Canada has a seaweed solution that I use and it seems to work great. I apply it in feeding and as a foliar (sp) spray. Do any of you use it, or something similiar? I have not had trouble in two years with disease since starting using it.

C gave me some fertilizing tips, and mine in the past haven't matched hers close enough. I put 2-3" PVC pipe, 24" long, tilted out and high, about 6 inches deep, and out through the CRW, in the planting hole and I water and fertilize through it, and do it often. I think I fertilize more often than needed. But I try to use safe stuff hoping the plant takes what it needs and leaves the rest alone.

I see very little here about green sand. Is that usage just a myth?

Back to eggshells. I thought of pulverizing them in a blender and adding to the planting hole. Or is there something better? Epsom salts? I want to get the right nutrients in the ground to start with and can handle the watering as needed.

Don

[Dr_Redwine]

I have never used eggshells, but I do use a about a 1/3 to 1/2 cup of epsom salts at planting time per plant. I saw an older gentleman from Texas on PBS do this. Willing to experiment, I began to make it part of my ritual.

I didn't do it last year on a few plants and could not get the fruits to set on chest-high plants. They were blooming like crazy and simply falling off. In my quick analysis of my problem, I remembered that I didn't have any epsom salts at planting time and noted too that they may have been getting too much nitrogen from a nearby pile of grass clippings. I sprinkled some ES around them in the following days and moved the pile, and fruits began to set. Who knows which did the trick, but I'll continue to use the Epson salts; I always use it around peppers, too.

DrR

[giardiniere]

I've heard of the use of Epsom Salt, but have never tried it. I do throw in a handful of Bone Meal at planting time.

[TomatoDon]

What is the supplement or soil amendment that prevents BER? Epsom Salts? Eggshells? There is something you add to eliminate BER but I can't remember what it is.

Don

[Rena]

Calcium but I believe (someone correct me if I am wrong) can also be caused from uneven watering. I also believe that romas are more prone to getting it. I have seen it in one of my container Green Zebras and with some Juliet tomatoes in the greenhouse.
I always toss all of my used egg shells in the garden. I throw in a handful of bone meal when I plant. It would be wise to get a soil sample and then you would know if you are lacking.
On a side note growing up we had chickens and they started laying eggs that literally had soft shells. They were almost translucent, my Dad went down to the local Coop and brought back a huge bag of Oyster shells crushed calcium and began mixing it with their food. Cured them. I have often pondered doing this in a tomato hole but wonder if it would take ages for the calcium to actually release....any ideas???-Rena

[TomatoDon]

I'm not really sure. I have some bottled liquid from the CO-OP that is supposed to prevent it, and I use it as the plants get bigger, but have no idea what the real ingredients are. But I've never had much trouble with BER. Maybe that's why. And yes, it can be related to irregular watering.

I'd still like to get the soil right in the beginning. There would be little reason for me to have the soil tested since I dig the holes and fill them with compost or bagged soilless mix, or other things straight out of a sack.

I did find a product on the net called Cal-Mag Plus, so I guess BER is caused by a calcium or magnesium deficiency.

I get all excited about this stuff in February every year and want every fertilier and supplement I can find. But as they say in the nursery business, "don't love em to death." Meaning, don't over-fertilize, don't over water. I can be bad about both. More is not always better.

If you find anything else, post a reply.

Don

[Dr_Redwine]

I don't have a problem with BER, either. I did add lime once before very early in my gardening life and the tomatoes did NOT like it at all. Probably the worst i have ever grown. I suspect my soil pH is about right without it, so I never put lime out again because I think it may have made my pH too basic.

I think gypsum can be used as a calcium source with no effects on pH, but I am not sure about that. I do know you can use gypsum to help make clay more friable.

The magnesium in the Epsom salts is supposed to help with the blossom setting into fruit. I got that out of an organic gardening book that I have. That Cal-Mag stuff you have probably addresses both issues.
DrR

[TomatoDon]

Thanks Dr. Now I know why the Epsom Salts work as claimed.

Don

[TomatoDon]

Thanks KC,

Very detailed, very knowledgeable, very appropriate info you sent. Will read over it several times and copy it to a Word doc for my library.

Many thanks.

Don

[Gardyloo]

I had problems last year with the blossoms not setting, so I'll try the epsom salts this year.
Good tip, thank you!

Fish Emulsion (FE)- does it help tomatoes? I have a brugmansia that just loves FE, and I know a lot of other plants do too.

Last one, worm casings - I think Earl swears by these, and I hear they're great too. They did wonders for my roses.

I just worry a bit about over-supplementing.

[Gimme3]

Don, here come a few more angles of thought, nothin brazen etched in stone, jus things to ponder...)))

Mississipi has mighty good soil. Plants, all over this world, adapt an prosper in the native soils that they grow in. When one plants a fruit tree, an overwhelming prevailing opinion amongst experienced ochardists, is to plant the tree into, the native soil it will live in, ...DONT, plant it in Nirvana by 18 x 18. The reason is this...that young tree is gonna HAVE to spread it's roots, to become a healthy an vigorous specimen. Amendments for the young tree are simply good tilth, accomplished by digging the hole out well, and PH adjustments, in needed, initially. If the tree is planted into a temporary Paradise, it may ....upon reaching the borders of the hole, enact a root-circling , rather than spread on out and penetrate it's surroundings.


A tomato will grow to it's absolute fullfillment, in simple, balanced soil. Tilth is Key. Some folks classify a tomato as a heavy feeder, but...in my opinion, it aint that at all.

All it wants, is relatively consistent moisture, in balanced soil, it Loves Tilth, and sunshine, but not 95 degree temps.Humidity by itself aint no prob, but couple it w/ambient heat, an a tomato is GONNA get diseased, aint no way around it . Cool temps and non-stop rain, ditto...same results. All you can do, is learn suppression, fostering , and culturing techniques that You adapt, for your area..What falls from the sky, or how the jet-stream from Canada flows, it aint got no control over, nor do you or i.

BER comes from one thing...drastic fluctuation, across several weeks, in soil moisture. And there's a very simple way to cure it. Mulch yo plants heavily w/straw or hay, as soon as soil temps an Spring get on the real Upswing. Build the soil. The Raised beds are gonna give you fine drainage, and good tilth, but tilth should not be present merely in the hole.

To target specific aspects...eggshells need to broken down by soil life, before they would be capable of giving back available calcium to the soil. Thats why, eggshell aplication is gonna be a good long-term approach, or a fine additive to the compost pile, but they'll never give you rapidly available Calcium. Wood ashes are a rapidly available Calcium source, but discretion is advised, towards a full understanding of your soil, and if not, then a very light application. Epsom salts provide Magnesium in a quite available form, and Peppers and Tomatos will generally appreciate, as manifest by a deeper green hue in foilage, a mild application.

To re-iterate...native soils, are the tools each an every one of us have, to work with. And there is Great potential, in most native soils. A tomato is gonna give you a true picture across time, of it's Happiness w/yo native soil and tilth,... if you destort it's environment too much, it never will be able to.


Jus some thoughts...))) Mighty Best wishes...)))

[Dr_Redwine]

Hey Gimme3:

Some very deep thoughts there that make a lot of sense. Cool avatar, BTW.

From a fellow Country Boy,
DrR

[Gimme3]

Ty, Dr. R....an Roll Tide, or War Eagle !

i only try to encourage ...

8)

This pic....tears me up,but also makes me feel so Happy, every time i look at it ...

Waylon....check out Johnnie's shirt, and thats a mighty long time ago, in human years...)))


Hope Don dont mind the accompaniement, it's hard to separate one thing from another,... so close, as they are....)))

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b6...hnnyDonnie.jpg

[Dr_Redwine]

Gimme3:
It's War Eagle all the way. BCE '88 and MCE '92.
DrR