Member discussion regarding the methods, varieties and merits of growing tomatoes.
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July 8, 2013 | #1 | |||
Crosstalk™ Forum Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: 8407 18th Ave West 7-203 Everett, Washington 98204
Posts: 1,157
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Blue Tomato Precursors
Blue tomatoes are a mixed lot..... containing snippets of several wild species... Chessmanii, Lycopersicoides, and Chilense added to Lycopersicum.
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/F6bHskj.png?1[/IMG] along with such commercial tomatoes of questionable flavor...VF36 and a couple of unknown varieties...Vigoroz? and/or unknown. There has got to be some genetic drag leading to less flavor than we would like. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/sqmYobo.png?1[/IMG] How did it get started? Quote:
There is more to the story but the following will give you some idea of the genesis for a blue tomato.... http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...ient=firefox-a Breeding Tomatoes for Improved Antioxidant Activity by Peter J. Mes 2004 Quote:
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Since I am a breeder of blue potatoes and blue corn....I am fascinated by observations such as blue potatoes having a microbial resistance in the tubers. Sorry about my disjointed writing style ....I am biting at the bit to get out to the field to add to my already 250 crosses made. String tags everywhere! |
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July 9, 2013 | #2 |
Crosstalk™ Forum Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: 8407 18th Ave West 7-203 Everett, Washington 98204
Posts: 1,157
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I took a picture of the tomatoes that have the atv and the Aft genes...and these were involved in the breeding work that led up to the Indigo Rose.
On the left side is the atv plant....some anthocyanin in the stems but not as much as I thought there would be...it is very tall and has long internodes...and I see this trait coming through in various progeneies...especially Helsing ★★★★★★★★ Blue. On the right side of the picture is the accession with the Aft gene....this vine is very determinate and has fruits with horns on them much like Indigo Rose will have. I wonder if the original chessmanii wild accession had horns? The fruits of the Aft line are so shaded...no blue is showing up. No wonder the open habit of the atv vine was adopted in the final work... After this photo was taken I used pollen from the atv to cross to the Aft vine. |
July 9, 2013 | #3 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Finland, EU
Posts: 2,550
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Do you sample and eat these fruits of 'work-still-in-progress'? How do they taste?
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July 10, 2013 | #4 | |
Crosstalk™ Forum Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: 8407 18th Ave West 7-203 Everett, Washington 98204
Posts: 1,157
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Quote:
I have these precursors of the Indigo Rose planted in different areas and the plants pictured were grown for a few weeks under the low plastic tunnels with slitted sides. Once the plastic was off...it was warm enough to grow the plants normally. The fruits won't be ready until August/September and most of the other plants might produce by October. What I want to determine is if any of the three types of plants used in the breeding of Indigo Rose have a flavor disadvantage due to genetic drag coming from the species of cheesmaii, chilense, and lycopersicoides or if it is just the original cultivars such as VF36 that are responsible. I have the VF36 in Hawaii to get a flavor test. Using each of the ancestral lines in crosses with other types of tomatoes will help me recognize dominant or recessive flavor combining ability. Likely, I will send the initial hybrid work to Hawaii to be grown out of season (for me anyway) in order to get F-2 seed for my 2014 trials. I don't know how many of my 320 different combination crosses have taken during the last two weeks...but I know the following are among the many blue crosses: LA1996 (Aft) x LA0791{atv) LA1996 (Aft) x Indigo Rose Abg x Indigo Rose LA0791{atv) x Indigo Rose Yamali Blue x LA0791(atv) LA0791 (atv) x Dancing with Smurfs LA1996 (Aft) x Dancing with Smurfs Because the "take" of hand pollinations are iffy...I will make more crosses as needed. I just happened to think of more crosses to make...especially to high flavored green and gold lines such as Green Grape Beyond and Flaming Burst. |
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May 29, 2017 | #5 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 134
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I'm growing LA1996 this season. Didn't know it had Solanum chilense ancestry until now. So that's cool. How did it do for you? I'm excited for it. Seems to be quite hardy so far.
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May 29, 2017 | #6 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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Quote:
Carolyn
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Carolyn |
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May 29, 2017 | #7 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2012
Location: massachusetts
Posts: 1,710
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Genetic drag.
Had a GF once that was alright, but met her family and was scared off, father was abusive, mother was strange, brother was an idiot savant. I ran. Never knew what to call what I feared. Thanks Tom, it was genetic drag. |
January 15, 2018 | #8 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 134
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Quote:
I guess Genetic Drag is what all those terribly inbred domestic tomatoes that fail to grow for me also have. Genetic Drag. |
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January 15, 2018 | #9 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Colorado
Posts: 134
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I grew LA1996 this summer. It did fantastic! I actually found a tomato that does well for me and is very productive and has large fruit! A line i am going to keep growing for sure. It was not very blue though, a little, but not as much as i expected.
How are the LA4425, LA3668 Aubergine(Abg) fruit lines from S.lycopersicoides? I'm wondering if i should grow them too. What is this Atv gene? |
January 17, 2018 | #10 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: New England
Posts: 661
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I will try the Blueberry this year. Bought seed last year but didnt get it in for 2017.
In the meantime, only blue/black grapes get my money. Adding purple carrots to the garden. Added purple potatoes last year. With much reading the blue tomatoes are not as appetizing as other varieties making me reluctant to jump in despite the possible nutritional benefits. I grew Green Envy f1 last summer and most were spitters---I now have the term for when son and I literally spat out the foul tasting flesh (when not ripe or too ripe) Only fruit we "spat". I will extend that experience to the Blueberry and give it a try this year and risk a few spitters. WIll try the fruits in salsas, and other recipes that use tomatillos. Looking forward to better tasting blues! |
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