looking for a good determinate paste tomato

[where_with_all]

Hello all,

I am still on my quest for a paste tomato for next season. I had considered san marzano nano but opted against after I got multiple feedback on this forum and other places on the taste.

Can anybody suggest a decent determinate paste tomato for canning? Preferably it would have decent taste for salsa and for sauce. I would like a determinate so that I can do all my canning (jarring) at once during the season.

Two varieties mentioned to me were:

Rio Grande – determinate
Fiaschette di manduria-determinate


Any comments or other recommendations?

Thanks

[Grub]

Wuhib? I'm growing it this year.

Google... drum-roll...

Posted by Carolyn137 z4/5 NY (My Page) on
Sat, Aug 27, 05 at 15:57
Heidi, nice red plum type on a det plant, from Cameroon and a fave of many
Wuhib, also red plums on a det plant, from Ethiopia
Opalka, long red indet paste type, from Poland
Martino's Roma,red plum, det, rugose foliage, from Italy
All of the above are very very productive.

But like many who post here at GW who find that paste tomatoes have the lousiest tastes of all types, are prone to Early Blight ( A solani) and Blossom End Rot, I also prefer to use any great tasting meaty tomatoes that are available.

Just cook down the sauce a bit more to the consistency you want.

[montanamato]

Ropreco paste was a new paste for me this year...It had good taste for fresh eating, and was a hint juicier than most...Also about 10 days earlier than my other paste types...fruit were variable , with many smallish ones.

Jeanne

[Mantis]

Got two Opalkas in and going. Three fruit set on the one in a big pot. I don't usually grow paste types as the taste is ordinary and the problems many. But a US southern fella has talked me into them. Time will tell.

[where_with_all]

Wuhib- never heard of it. Grub where did you get the seeds?

I have heard great things about heidi. Is heidi a det?

Is there anymore info on ropreco. Any others? Any comments on rio grande and Fiaschette di manduria?

[montanamato]

I believe Wuhib and Heidi are on the Sand Hill Preservation web site. Ropreco Paste is on the Seeds of Change web site....The others I am not sure of...

Jeanne

[carolyn137]

Heidi is a variety I got from a former student, Heidi Iyok, from Cameroon. It's det, bears heavily and has darn good taste and is a fave of many.

There are two varieties I also got from a former student, Tasdesse Wuhib, that he got for me in the marketplace in Addis Abbaba in Ethiopia.

I cleverly named them Tadesse and Wuhib.

Both of these are also det, and bear heavily as well, and both are pretty good tasting.

Martino's Roma is a variety I got from the SSE Yearbook years ago and is an heirloom from the western part of NYS. it's det and has the most beautiful deep green rugose foliage and also bears heavily.

Opalka I got from a colleague at the place where I taught but that's indet and det were asked about.

All that being said, you saw the above quote attributed to me re even using paste types for sauce or canning. I think it's best to use the absolute BEST tasting varieties for those purposes.

Nothing wrong with the above, and Heidi can be eaten fresh it's so good, but what's happened over the years, I think, is the perpetuation of using paste tomatoes for sauce as was done in the Mediterranean countries and those practices were brought to the US by those who immigrated here.

They didn't have available to them all the wonderful varieties we now have available to us.

I almost forgot to say that over the years, as many of you know, I've sent varieties for trial to places I trust and Sandhill Preservation is one of those places and Glenn is listing Heidi and Wuhib and Martino's Roma although he lists the latter as indet and it's not, it's truly like a wee Xmas tree when fruits are ripe and quite det.

[where_with_all]

carolyn,

How do the yields, taste and disease resistance compare for all three. Is heidi (In your OPINION) better tasting ect.

I would think for det paste tomatoes, some one somewhere has done a study on yields vs. disease resistance vs taste. given the commercial implications.

[carolyn137]

(How do the yields, taste and disease resistance compare for all three. Is heidi (In your OPINION) better tasting ect.)

Production is high for all of them; I don't count fruits or weigh them. For me the best tasting is Heidi.

(I would think for det paste tomatoes, some one somewhere has done a study on yields vs. disease resistance vs taste. given the commercial implications.)

Actually I don't see any commercial applications that would warrant anyone doing those kinds of studies.

Just talking about disease tolerance alone means that the varieties would have to be challenged in an approved lab and since all the heirloom types are orphans, who is going to pay for that?

I can only speak to the diseases known to occur in my upstate NY garden and they would be about the same as what you have on the Island/

That is, NO variety, hybrid or heirloom, has disease tolerance against the most common tomato diseases which are the foliage diseases. There are a few exceptions, hybrids all, but they are of no use to the home gardener.

You and I don't have problems with Fusarium, Verticillium is rare, we have no problems with nematodes, so it comes down to foliage diseases.

And since ALL new foliage diseases are arirborne that means that the incidnce of these will be related to how far you live from areas where those diseases are affecting other tomatoes.

However, one can protect them from the more severe fungal foliage diseases by using a good anti-fungal such as Otho Garden Disease Control, aka Daconil.

As a general rule most paste tomatoes are more prone to BER, and are more susceptible to Early BLight ( A. solani)

But Heidi and Martino's Roma and Wuhib seem to do pretty darn good in that regard as compared with Opalka which seems to get BER more often and also A. solani.

I'll mention here that I'm very enthusiastic about the paste tomato Mama Leone which I've sent to several places for trial. And I'm also enthusiastic about another paster called Perito Italian which I'll be listing in the 2007 SSE Yearbook and possibly distributing seeds here if I decide to do so.

Finally, I still say that using great tasting meaty tomatoes for sauce, not necessarily paste tomatoes which do not have a good reputation for great taste, is the way to go.

[where_with_all]

(I would think for det paste tomatoes, some one somewhere has done a study on yields vs. disease resistance vs taste. given the commercial implications.)

Actually I don't see any commercial applications that would warrant anyone doing those kinds of studies.

I would think market growers would want to know which paste tomatoes yield the best.

Finally, I still say that using great tasting meaty tomatoes for sauce, not necessarily paste tomatoes which do not have a good reputation for great taste, is the way to go.

Carolyn, you left me hanging-- What meaty non-paste tomatoes would you suggest?? This is especially interesting for me with regards to salsa, where a beafsteak is way to juicy.


On another note, has anyone ever tasted Rio grande?

BTW, I enjoy talking tomatoes with you Carolyn. I always learn so much!

[carolyn137]

(I would think market growers would want to know which paste tomatoes yield the best.)

Such info is available for many hybrids but not that much for the heirloom types. In addition, as you know, yields can vary widely with some OP's from year to year, so that's another consideration.

Carolyn said:
Finally, I still say that using great tasting meaty tomatoes for sauce, not necessarily paste tomatoes which do not have a good reputation for great taste, is the way to go.

Carolyn, you left me hanging-- What meaty non-paste tomatoes would you suggest?? This is especially interesting for me with regards to salsa, where a beafsteak is way to juicy.

I mentioned sauce, you mentioned salsa but I think we're on the same wave length here.

Here's just a few that I consider to be meaty and dense:

Wes
Red Penna
Chapman
Neves Azorean Red
Russian #117
Zogola
Cuostralee
Russian Bogatyr
Rostova
Large Pink Bulgarian
Andrew Rahart's Jumbo Red


....... for starters, off the top of my head.