Showdown at Suze's

[feldon30]

I made another visit to Suze's yesterday. We stopped well short of tasting 49 tomato varieties this time. A dozen seemed plenty.

Pink: Aunt Ginny's Purple, Earl's Faux, Brandy Boy, Grandfather Ashlock

AGP was nice. Not a blockbuster for me, especially compared to the incredible Earl's Faux and Brandy Boy. A ripe Brandywine Sudduth's was not available. Grandfather Ashlock was not memorable.



Black/Purple: Vorlon, Brad's Black Heart
Brad's Black Heart had a good flavor and that sharp contrast of red and orange flesh with green locules that actually looks like some of the unverifiable pictures which have been posted by seed catalogs of Black Sea Man.

Suze showed courage in the face of adversity and gave BSM another shot. It was a spitter. Just looking at the cut fruit, it does not look like a winner. It's kind of dry and the brownish-purple color is kind of pale and uninteresting. Compare this to Cherokee Purple, etc. which have flesh of a striking, glistening color.

Vorlon was quite nice.



Green: Green Giant, Humph

Once again, that "green when ripe" tomato flavor that so many have spoken about remained elusive for me. It's frustrating. I found Green Giant to taste better than Humph (Suze liked both) but I could not imagine growing either at least for my tastes.

Green Giant is distinctive among green-when-ripes because even closeup, the tomato gives up few clues that it is ripe. Faint pinkish-yellow hues appear only on the bottom. My response when Suze pointed to a ripe one was "Are you kidding?" Anyone growing Green Giant would be wise to start checking the larger fruits by feel when they approach DTM. I have heard of an experienced gardener letting many fruits rot on the vine because they showed no obvious sign of ripeness.




Orange/Gold: Summer Cider, Yellow Brandywine (Platfoot), Aunt Gertie's Gold, Gingersnap

I found Summer Cider to have a very good flavor and I am considering growing it, since it was productive for Suze. Choosing a favorite between Yellow Brandywine and Aunt Gertie's Gold was tough for me, I liked both. I tasted an acidic spiciness in all three that I really liked. I think I like gold tomatoes more than Suze does. I have also gotten to taste Kellogg's Breakfast and found it to have a very nice smooth, spicy flavor. I think Gold tomatoes would be exceptional when dehydrated or roasted.

P.S. Gingersnap was REVOLTING.


Can't Deny that it's July
Some of the fruits are starting to show heat stress with corking on the top and uneven ripening, and some of Suze's plants have definitely been stricken with various blights, but what is amazing is that a good 80% of her plants still look very healthy and are still loaded up with fruit. It has to be some kind of record.



I'm back in Houston with another table full of tomatoes to parcel out to unsuspecting friends.

[duajones]

I hope one day to taste as many varieties as you have in the last month Morgan, you lucky dawg And the truth is, everyone here is right in my back yard, or back room if you wish. Isnt the internet a wondeful thing?

[carolyn137]

Princess of Pistils here who has not been in the habit of reading threads posted in the regional Forums but is so glad she did, meaning this thread.

Gorgeous Suze, just gorgeous and if you folks don't know it this past month Suze sent me two huge boxes of carefully wrapped fruits all labeled, both on the bubble wrap tape and then initials on the fruits themselves.

I got to taste many I'd not grown and I got to compare some that I had sent her seeds for that originated with me, such as Perito Italian, Prue, Sarnowski Polish Plum and I can't remember the rest now.

About Indian Stripe.

It IS Cherokee Purple, kinda. I think some of you have forgotten the background on this one.

A friend of mine in TX was visiting relatives in Arkansas and down the road a bit noticed this one in the garden of a very elderly man. He called it Indian Stripe or Indian Zebra. Donna thought it looked and tasted like CP and sent me seeds.

It's the same as CP except the fruits are a bit smaller, a bit lighter in color and more to the truss.

And I know a couple of folks who seem to prefer Indian Stripe over CP, but I don't know if they've grown both in the same year to make a direct comparison which should even out a lot of variables.

I think it's an excellent example of a variety grown in isolation, and the Cherokee had and still have a presence in that area, and how subtle changes happened over time, as compared with the CP that Craig got seeds for from John Green of TN, which neighbors Arkansas.

I thank Donna for her sharp eye. She lives in the burbs of Houston and is an excellent gardener.

[Rena]

Suze needs to try another strain of BSM it is not dry at all.... My source was SSE catalog. Edited to add I love Summer Cider. It did very well here last year in the heat.

[spyfferoni]

I just stumbled across this thread---great pics---amazing garden---and great comments on all of the tomatoes you both tasted. I'm very excited to try Earl's Faux now! I also will be trying Cherokee Purple, Cherokee Chocolate, Carbon, and Noir de Crimee---that is if the plants ever set fruit. I haven't heard much about JD's Special C-Tex. Is it a regional tomato? Our summers have been so hot the last few years with never ending ending heat waves, that I'm really considering looking at what does good in the Texas heat and planting that here. I think I am going to try planing bigger plants too.

Thanks for the great thread!

Tyff

[feldon30]

JD's Special C-Tex is a variety developed by a commercial greenhouse operator and apparently hobbyist tomato breeder named JD in Conroe, TX. Its flavor and appearance suggests a similar lineage to Cherokee Purple but blew us away in flavor and productivity. It was the unequivocal taste winner at SETTFest.

[Suze]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

About Indian Stripe.

It IS Cherokee Purple, kinda. I think some of you have forgotten the background on this one[...]

It's the same as CP except the fruits are a bit smaller, a bit lighter in color and more to the truss.

And I know a couple of folks who seem to prefer Indian Stripe over CP, but I don't know if they've grown both in the same year to make a direct comparison which should even out a lot of variables.

I didn't forget; I just didn't mention it. This is the first year I've grown it. You sent me seeds a couple of years ago and I never messed with it because because I figured what's the point of growing a smaller CP when I can just grow the CP? But since I'm not so limited on space here as I was before, I thought it was time to give it a try.

CP has not done that well for me the past few years in terms of productivity, which is one reason I thought I'd take a year off from it. Indian Stripe did just fine this year in that regard, and the fruits weren't really significantly smaller. One thing I did notice is that it's about a shade lighter than CP. I did not get any striping.

But as you say, a direct comparison is best, and since I didn't also grow CP this year, I shouldn't generalize. I will say CC was not that productive for me, though.

Originally Posted by IMISSCOLO

Suze needs to try another strain of BSM it is not dry at all.... My source was SSE catalog. Edited to add I love Summer Cider. It did very well here last year in the heat.

My source was also the SSE catalog. I also didn't get much of the interesting coloration BSM is sometimes known for. My spring was very, very cool and rainy - maybe that affected flavor and texture.

[Suze]

Originally Posted by feldon30

I made another visit to Suze's yesterday. We stopped well short of tasting 49 tomato varieties this time. A dozen seemed plenty.

Actually, it was thirteen. I don't think I wrote down the BW Sud, and I think you forgot about tasting it again since you think it just doesn't compare to your beloved FlipTX strain.

Also, in general, I think the taste of much of what we sampled was a bit watered down due to all the rain the week before.

Pink: Aunt Ginny's Purple, Earl's Faux, Brandy Boy, Grandfather Ashlock, BW Sudduth

Earl's Faux was the best of the bunch. AGP was second.

I thought Grandfather Ashlock was better than average, but no blockbuster. However, one I've eaten since our tasting was much, much better -- probably an 8.25. BW Sud was watery -- it can be fickle, but when it's good, it is very good indeed. I ate one yesterday that was top notch; one of the very best tomatoes I had all year.

Brandy Boy is pretty good! I like it, didn't think I would. However, it doesn't seem to be any more productive for me than BW Sud. Both are loaded this year; in a normal hot Texas year, results would probably vary. I almost started to put a Brandy Boy in one of those boxes I sent Carolyn, and tell her it was a "mystery heirloom", of course breaking the news to her after she tasted it. But that would be wrong. *snicker*

Black/Purple: Vorlon, Brad's Black Heart

Both were great, better when it's not so rainy. They also could have been a little more ripe.

Green: Green Giant, Humph

Green Giant - 9 easily. I really love it. Humph is also very, very good - 8.5-9.

Orange/Gold: Summer Cider, Yellow Brandywine (Platfoot), Aunt Gertie's Gold, Gingersnap

I like the golds fine, but the ones we tasted could have been a little riper.

AGG and YB rate a 9 easily when dead ripe. Unfortunately, not that productive for me. Summer Cider - 8 to 8.25 and fairly productive -- at least 20 tomatoes from one plant.

Kellogg's Breakfast (not tasted) is definitely above average, but never has been a real blockbuster to my tastebuds.

Gingersnap - *cringe*

The "corking" (weather checking) is probably more due to the extreme amount of rain than the relatively minor amount of heat I've had here this year.

[ddsack]

Wonderful thread, never would have found it if Feldon hadn't pointed it out elsewhere. Suze - your garden is just fabulous! And Feldon, your pics and the summary reports are impressive.

Is it time to think of devoting a special forum to taste testing results? The topic pops up in various places, and in the end, taste is why we are all growing tomatoes, right? It would be nice to have one place to check on opinions when we're considering a new variety. Of course tastes will vary (Feldon dislikes greens, Suze loves them) but still we can learn from some general consensus.

Dee

[elkwc36]

Suze first great garden. Just found this thread. After reading all of this makes me want to come down your SETT Fest next year. I'm looking forward to tasting my Indian Stripe now. And hate I lost my Earl's Faux. Again thanks Feldon and Suze for sharing photo's and information. Also where did you find Turk's Mut seeds? I may have to try that one. Feldon had mentioned it but had never heard of it before. Jay

[Suze]

Originally Posted by elkwc36

Suze first great garden. Just found this thread. After reading all of this makes me want to come down your SETT Fest next year. I'm looking forward to tasting my Indian Stripe now. And hate I lost my Earl's Faux. Again thanks Feldon and Suze for sharing photo's and information. Also where did you find Turk's Mut seeds? I may have to try that one. Feldon had mentioned it but had never heard of it before. Jay

Jay, thanks for the kind words. Ah, memories! My garden sure doesn't look like that now. It is an utter mess, and if I weren't sick this week (bad cold) I'd already have most of the plants pulled.

I got my Turks Mut seeds from Deer Park. He is a very nice man and always sends me lots of extras whenever we trade. I will say what I am growing is PL, and frankly I'm not quite sure if it is the same variety as Turks Nuts or if it's supposed to be RL or PL. I need to ask him.

In the spring, I got PL seedlings and decided to go with them after googling a bit and finding a Turks Muts PL.

Morgan just told me that from my saved seeds, he is getting about 50/50 RL/PL. Cross or instability, beats me. I told him to go with the PL if he wanted to get what I got.

Having said that, you're welcome to seeds if you want. PM me in the fall.

[Worth1]

Just to set the record strait Suze when I came by your house last monday to get the tomato plants you did NOT get that cold from me.
I feel fine.
Get better soon.

Worth

[Suze]

Originally Posted by Worth1

Just to set the record strait Suze when I came by your house last monday to get the tomato plants you did NOT get that cold from me.
I feel fine.
Get better soon.

Thanks! I figure I got it on the plane (and hope I didn't give it to you). Sounds like I didn't.

[MsCowpea]

Suze, what a phenomenal garden! Your plants look fantastic. All those varieties of tomatoes look beautiful and some very exotic. I also have many raised beds so I know that was alot of work putting it all together.

You mentioned alfalfa and cornmeal--about how much of each are you using in each 3 by 12 raised bed?

I have used these little squares of alfalfa that I got at the feed store in the past but I don't have a clue as to how much to use so I was wondering how much you added of your organic- type fert.

(Feldon, let me echo everyone else-excellent presentation.
Trying to not let it weaken my resolve to grow fewer tomatoes this year.)

[Suze]

Originally Posted by MsCowpea

You mentioned alfalfa and cornmeal--about how much of each are you using in each 3 by 12 raised bed?

I mixed the two together and used about a 5 gal bucket for every 5 beds (one gal per bed). I think that may be just a little more than is recommended, but that looked about right at the time.

I also scattered just a bit more alfalfa later in the season after the first round of fruit set, in addition to the slow release non-organic stuff.

The plan next spring is to topdress all the beds with at least a couple of inches of manure at least a month or two before planting, then turn it all in. I may also add some more cornmeal and alfalfa, and some shredded leaves I have piled up which are well onto their way to the leaf mold stage.

I figure those beds *have* to be rather depleted after the rather productive growing season, and I think I'd rather err on the side of possibly feeding the soil too much rather than not enough. Having pulled most of my spring plants now, it's quite apparent that the soil level has dropped down several inches. Sure, some of it was settling, but I figure it is in large part due to the breakdown of OM.