Phospherous defincy

augiedog55 · July 5, 2014

Ive notice the last week my plants in 13 containers look like they have phospherous defincy. The are new folage is light green with purple highlights on it and the older green folage is getting the purple high lights also. I can't figure it it out. I'm growing in 10 and 15 gallon smart pots with 60 40 promix and black kow manure. I've been feeding TTF for about a month at a rate of 1 gallontwice a week and then just watering and flusdhing out the rest of the week. I water every day.
I've got my neighbor growing in the same set up except and his plants are being feed mittleiders majic per (Carloyn Phillips just showing off thread) and his are thriving . I'm perplexed.
Any suggestions on how to fix it.Or do I just change to feeding the Mittleider mix?

Thanks
Bruce

augiedog55 · July 5, 2014

Even some stems and veins have purple in them

Ed of Somis · July 5, 2014

I am not positive about this...but I think some varieties might be prone to different shades of foliage. If your plants look healthy and are doing well...maybe leave well-enough alone???

JamesL · July 5, 2014

Can you post a picture?

augiedog55 · July 5, 2014

I wish I could post a picture but I'm a computer dumby.

RayR · July 5, 2014

I would say fertilizer has nothing to do with it. Is your container mix too wet? Not draining properly? 40% manure sounds like too much to me.

KarenO · July 5, 2014

pH of the soil mix may be the issue.
KO

heirloomtomaguy · July 5, 2014

If you are positive it is a phosphate deficiency foliar spray with earth juice bloom master water soluble fertilizer. It is a 0-50-30 so be careful not to over mix the solution. Its organic and will turn those plants green and start a whole lot of tomato flowers. Works great for me.

Dutch · July 5, 2014

Augie, You should definitely check the PH level of your growing mix. 40% manure is a lot. Manure that has not been limed or is under limed is typically acidic or low in PH and smells like Sulfur Dioxide (SO2) or rotten eggs (sh*t). Over limed manure does not have much smell at all and can be alkaline or high in PH and limit vegetables like tomatoes from taking up nutrients properly.
Dutch

RayR · July 5, 2014

Black Kow is a thermophilic compost, PH shouldn't be a problem. If it was unfinished manure I could see it might be a PH problem or turn into an anaerobic smelly mess.
What I was thinking is whether 40% of the stuff was causing too much water retention without adding additional perlite or whatever. If the roots are too wet, the same symptoms of nutrient deficiencies can occur when there are no actual nutrient deficiencies in the soil.
I wouldn't think that would happen in Smart Pots since they drain and dry out faster than plastic containers. Actually the same symptoms can occur if the roots are too dry too.

Bruce, we are all speculating as to what the cause is based on your description.
I just don't see that actual nutrients could be the problem as long as you are fertilizing with TTF as directed.

Dutch · July 6, 2014

Unlimed or under limed manure can also produces hydrogen sulfide (H2S) which is also an acid and because of the sulfur component it has a similar smell and a low PH like sulfur dioxide SO2. Hydrogen sulfide in manure results from the bacterial breakdown of organic matter, in the absence of oxygen, this process is commonly known as anaerobic digestion.

But here is the important part! I would be more worried about an over limed manure. They do that so it doesn’t stink as much. And if you did buy an over limed manure and added lime to it, you have even more of a problem. Add to that, that some water wells are much higher in PH than others and your soils PH could be higher than you might imagine.
You really should check the PH of your soil at this point.
Augie, was this Black Kow bagged or in bulk? Did you add lime to your container soil?

Dutch

Dutch · July 6, 2014

Bruce, (sorry about calling you Augie) I agree with Ray that we are all just speculating as to what the cause is based on your description. At this point we need some input from you.
Dutch

Hermitian · July 6, 2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by heirloomtomaguy

If you are positive it is a phosphate deficiency foliar spray with earth juice bloom master water soluble fertilizer. It is a 0-50-30 so be careful not to over mix the solution. Its organic and will turn those plants green and start a whole lot of tomato flowers. Works great for me.

This product will definitely cause healthy plants to bloom but also the brand's claim of "organic" is a partial truth. The reality is that it is manufactured with chemical grade potassium phosphate and a little bit of guano thrown in. The product has recently been recalled in several states due to stricter labeling laws.

Dutch · July 6, 2014

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hermitian

This product will definitely cause healthy plants to bloom but also the brand's claim of "organic" is a partial truth. The reality is that it is manufactured with chemical grade potassium phosphate and a little bit of guano thrown in. The product has recently been recalled in several states due to stricter labeling laws.

Good information Richard! Thanks!
Dutch

augiedog55 · July 6, 2014

I bought the Black Kow Manure at HD in the yellow and black bags. I believe they are 50 lbs. I mixed the3 of them with a 4 lb compressed bale of pro mix bx . When i put the mixture in the bags i added approximately 1 and cups of domolite lime to each pot. I was also thinking if its smart pots, all the excess water would run out the bottom and sides. The bags arent sitting on the deck I have them up on 2x4 s and expanded metal so air flows under them as well around them. . I'm perplexed. It summer and temps are around 90 so have to water every day or they would dry out, thats been my experience , in fact two yrs ago when it was in 100s for an extended period i had to water twice a day or they woul droop badly
I appreciated all your help . we will get it figured out.
Bruce
BTW Augie works too...lol

July 5, 2014	#1
augiedog55 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: oak grove mo Posts: 406	Phospherous defincy Ive notice the last week my plants in 13 containers look like they have phospherous defincy. The are new folage is light green with purple highlights on it and the older green folage is getting the purple high lights also. I can't figure it it out. I'm growing in 10 and 15 gallon smart pots with 60 40 promix and black kow manure. I've been feeding TTF for about a month at a rate of 1 gallontwice a week and then just watering and flusdhing out the rest of the week. I water every day. I've got my neighbor growing in the same set up except and his plants are being feed mittleiders majic per (Carloyn Phillips just showing off thread) and his are thriving . I'm perplexed. Any suggestions on how to fix it.Or do I just change to feeding the Mittleider mix? Thanks Bruce

July 5, 2014	#8
heirloomtomaguy Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2013 Location: glendora ca Posts: 2,560	If you are positive it is a phosphate deficiency foliar spray with earth juice bloom master water soluble fertilizer. It is a 0-50-30 so be careful not to over mix the solution. Its organic and will turn those plants green and start a whole lot of tomato flowers. Works great for me. __________________ “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."

July 5, 2014	#9
Dutch Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: S.E. Wisconsin Zone 5b Posts: 1,831	Augie, You should definitely check the PH level of your growing mix. 40% manure is a lot. Manure that has not been limed or is under limed is typically acidic or low in PH and smells like Sulfur Dioxide (SO2) or rotten eggs (sht). Over limed manure does not* have much smell at all and can be alkaline or high in PH and limit vegetables like tomatoes from taking up nutrients properly. Dutch Last edited by Dutch; July 6, 2014 at 08:12 AM. Reason: Clarify the smell of Sulfur dioxide (SO2) & added nott

July 5, 2014	#3
Ed of Somis Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Somis, Ca Posts: 649	I am not positive about this...but I think some varieties might be prone to different shades of foliage. If your plants look healthy and are doing well...maybe leave well-enough alone???

July 5, 2014	#4
JamesL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 1,992	Can you post a picture?

July 5, 2014	#6
RayR Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Cheektowaga, NY Posts: 2,466	I would say fertilizer has nothing to do with it. Is your container mix too wet? Not draining properly? 40% manure sounds like too much to me.

July 5, 2014	#7
KarenO Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Vancouver Island Posts: 5,924	pH of the soil mix may be the issue. KO

July 6, 2014	#11
Dutch Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: S.E. Wisconsin Zone 5b Posts: 1,831	Unlimed or under limed manure can also produces hydrogen sulfide (H2S) which is also an acid and because of the sulfur component it has a similar smell and a low PH like sulfur dioxide SO2. Hydrogen sulfide in manure results from the bacterial breakdown of organic matter, in the absence of oxygen, this process is commonly known as anaerobic digestion. But here is the important part! I would be more worried about an over limed manure. They do that so it doesn’t stink as much. And if you did buy an over limed manure and added lime to it, you have even more of a problem. Add to that, that some water wells are much higher in PH than others and your soils PH could be higher than you might imagine. You really should check the PH of your soil at this point. Augie, was this Black Kow bagged or in bulk? Did you add lime to your container soil? Dutch