Tomato String for Lean and Lower

[Gardeneer]

Thanks a lot, Bill, appreciated.
I have an engineering background and can make a rigid structure. Plus, there are lots of hard wood trees fallen down by the hurricane Mathew that I can use
Since there NO STONE or ROCK at all around here , have to use concrete mix to provide a good anchor support. .
I see how the farmers around here run the fence wire and put a lot of tension on them.
With one row, I think that I have to leave an extra space at the other end so that I can reverse the layering.
As an experiment and comparison, I will do another row using Florida Weave.
There will be some learning curve experience in 2017 with the soil, climate and support methods.

[jtjmartin]

A couple more questions with the 3/4" emt conduit trellis system. (I'm going to go for it.)

1) just stick the upright, vertical conduits into the ground?
2) do you use a bottom 3/4" emt conduit attached at ground level?
3) just use zip ties to fasten everything or do you reinforce the conduit with anything else?
4) will the tomahooks fit on to 3/4" conduit, or should I zip tie them on to the conduit?

Thanks.
Jeff

[Rajun Gardener]

Here's a few more ideas to consider with the same system and if you've never watched Bobby's videos then you really need to watch them.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDshyMYMpaQ

[jtjmartin]

Good video. Thanks.

[Jimbotomateo]

Originally Posted by Gardeneer

Thanks a lot, Bill, appreciated.
I have an engineering background and can make a rigid structure. Plus, there are lots of hard wood trees fallen down by the hurricane Mathew that I can use
Since there NO STONE or ROCK at all around here , have to use concrete mix to provide a good anchor support. .
I see how the farmers around here run the fence wire and put a lot of tension on them.
With one row, I think that I have to leave an extra space at the other end so that I can reverse the layering.
As an experiment and comparison, I will do another row using Florida Weave.
There will be some learning curve experience in 2017 with the soil, climate and support methods.

Gardeneer, are you using fence wire or concrete wire? Also how far inland are you and do you like your new area. Prolly pretty different than PNW. Jimbo

[Gardeneer]

Originally Posted by Jimbotomateo

Gardeneer, are you using fence wire or concrete wire? Also how far inland are you and do you like your new area. Prolly pretty different than PNW. Jimbo

Jimbo, I have not use any wires yet but I have some electric fence wire that is pretty strong and galvanized. They have used it just behind my garden . They run it for hundreds of feet and put tension on it with some kind of ratchet system.

My location is about 50 miles from Myrtle Beach , SC but I am in NC, across the state line. I move here this past September . So my experience is near zero. I know they grow lots of corn, watermelon, strawberry , soybean, sweet potato and cotton around here. The soil is very sandy loam . So I am amending it with lots of organic matter. wood ash with fine charcoal. I will also mix in some peat moss in the planting holes.
I have been told that this soil is just fine as long as you feed and water plants when needed. Amazingly the grass (lawn) is doing just fine. That is what I like.
It is a lot different from PNW, for sure.

[BigVanVader]

In my hardpan clay I just drive the conduit in with a 15lb sledge and they dont move. In sandy soil you may have an issue with stability.

[Salsacharley]

15 lb sledge? Holy guacamole! I find a 2 lb sledge will do a number on conduit. Frankly, an 8 lb sledge does a number on me after swinging it a while.

Originally Posted by BigVanVader

In my hardpan clay I just drive the conduit in with a 15lb sledge and they dont move. In sandy soil you may have an issue with stability.

[jtjmartin]

Thanks BVV.

Will the tomahooks hook on to the conduit, or do you have to attach them with zip ties?

[AKmark]

I don't know about using tomahooks on conduit, I would run cable or tension wire if it were me. The TH's I have will not fit on conduit, I just looked.

[BigVanVader]

They wont. You can use the metal straps with a small bolt through them attached to the conduit. This stuff. Leave it a little lose so you can slide it where you need it.

metal strapping.jpg

[jtjmartin]

Perfect solution. Thanks.

[b54red]

I use mostly 1/2 inch metal conduit for everything except the top horizontal bar. I do also use a bottom bar along the ground to tie off my lines so the line will be taut to better support the new seedlings in the windy weather of early spring. I also use it so I can start training my seedlings on to lines that are already on a diagonal so that that they are already going in the direction I want to lean them when I lower them.

If you have to use tomahooks then just adapt something to hang on the conduit that can be lifted so you can go past the junctures where the verticals met the horizontal bars when you reach them and you will eventually as you lean the plants. I see no need for tomahooks and just tie my lines with enough extra wrapped around the horizontal to lower them the first time or two. I don't try to have enough extra for more than that as it can be slow unwrapping it. Unless you have your horizontal bar high enough that you need a ladder the tomahook seems like it would just create a problem by shortening the time between lowering the plants. I just tie on another 3 or 4 feet of line when needed. The knot strength of the square bale twine is high and will hold without slipping with a simple knot made by aligning the two lines with the ends even and just making a simple knot. This will not slip and takes only seconds to do.

I cut off two feet of my 10' conduit for my verticals which are 8' and I just push about a foot into the ground so they end up being around 7' tall and the horizontals are attached a few inches below that. This is the height that I can reach and work with without needing a step stool or ladder. I use the 2' pieces to go across the bed to attach the verticals together with two zip ties at each juncture. This makes it much easier to support the heavier 3/4 inch verticals which I rest on them until they are also zip tied to both the vertical and the short cross piece. This results in a rectangular box of conduit about 18" wide and however long the bed is. This leaves me about a foot on each side that is free and clear for the vines to lay on as they are lowered and leaned. If you have diagonal supports going outside then it creates real problems as the vines get longer and have to go past the obstruction. I know because I found out the first year I used this method. Nothing like learning the hard way.

After the whole structure is tied together I then use diagonals of 6' to 8' lengths going from the verticals towards the center of the bed to brace the verticals. I do this on almost all my verticals so that the whole structure can withstand heavy winds or even me stumbling against them. I hammer the diagonals fairly deeply into the beds and am very careful before attaching them to the verticals to make sure the verticals are as upright as possible. I then zip tie them together and step back and check that everything is relatively straight.

I found that driving the verticals deep into the hard pan created a real problem when it came to taking them down at the end of the season. I ended up bending and even breaking a few back when I was using a trellis made of conduit. I could see if I kept that up it would get expensive replacing conduit. If I bend or break one of the diagonals it is no big deal because it can still be used for a support piece.

Bill

[jtjmartin]

Thanks Bill. I'm excited about using the system this coming year. I grew about half a dozen single-stem tomatoes on string this past year and really enjoyed it. Just getting the mechanicals down.

I will definitely take your advice and start to leaning the tomatoes from the start. That would have helped this last year.

[Gardeneer]

In my sandy soil, I imagine even a 4 by 4 post might not hold if you rum wire at tension from one to another. The native soil is pure fine sand (like play sand ) with some accumulation of loam/silt over the years. There no stone or rocks anywhere. Concrete mix is the solution. Another option that I think of is to bury a cinder block the place a conduit in one of its cells and fill just that cell with concrete. But then it would be something permanent.