Greetings from the Frigid North

HakaiRah · March 13, 2008

I'd like to thank everyone on this forum for the amazing wealth of knowledge I've been able to mine over the past couple weeks while lurking about. While I was able to plop some plants into the ground at the start of July last year when we finally moved out of our apartment into a house, this will be the first year my wife and I get a real garden.

I grew up helping my Mom garden, and visiting her father's amazing garden and seedling factory. Ok, it was just his basement but it felt like a factory to me at the time. Still, it's been over a decade since I last seriously helped out. Tomatoes are at the top of my list of things to grow, because I love them through gels and seeds dribbled down the front of my shirt after a bite out of a freshly picked one to heartburn from sauces. I do know I'm incredibly jealous of all the southerners that already have plants in the ground. I've got seedlings under lights, but we've got over a month before it'll be safe to drop them in the ground.

We have a ton of work to do to prepare all of our beds, because we only have around 4 inches of topsoil. Underneath its dense sand, and large glacial rocks. We're excavating to a little over a foot down, and will be bringing in dirt to replace the rocks and sand. We're moving the sand to create a second raised hill in our back yard. It'll be a long term project in soil improvement, where the garden beds are getting around 10 cubic yards of imported loam. It's a shortcut, but will let us build out our first 750 sqft of garden this spring instead of it being a multi-year project. I guess impatience is the curse of the fast food generation.

Thanks again for your store of knowledge, which hopefully in the coming months I might just be able to add a thing or two too.

My Tomato list for this year:
Black Cherry
Black Crimson
Carmello
Cherokee Purple
Italian Tree
Lollipop
Mexico
Tommy Toe
Brandywine
Bloody Butcher - (I couldn't resist the name)
Sweet Baby Girl
Druzba

**Dukerdawg** · March 13, 2008

Hey there! Congrats on the new house and of course on your first garden there. Sounds like you are doing all the right things to get off to a great start. I know it seems like I own stock (I don't really!) in these varieties, but I would add Aunt Gerties Gold and/or Yellow Brandywine to your list. Both are exceptional and you have plenty of time to start seeds. I won't even start my main crop for a couple of weeks yet. PM me your address if you want seeds and I can send you some.

Wish you the best and happy gardening!

Duane

barkeater · March 13, 2008

Welcome! You won't be able to resist the earliness and flavor of Bloody Butcher too. If it was larger it'd be the perfect tomato. You might want to add Moskvich for an early, great flavored, large red.

BTW, you have 2 months, minimum, before you can plant tomatoes in the ground in Massachusetts.

HakaiRah · March 13, 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by barkeater

Welcome! You won't be able to resist the earliness and flavor of Bloody Butcher too. If it was larger it'd be the perfect tomato. You might want to add Moskvich for an early, great flavored, large red.

BTW, you have 2 months, minimum, before you can plant tomatoes in the ground in Massachusetts.

Trying to peg the time with no previous experience was quite a challenge. Depending on which resource I looked at the date of last average frost seemed to vary from early April to late May. This probably means I've started this first batch of seedlings way too early. I take it early May is when you'd suggest then?

**Dukerdawg** · March 13, 2008

Here in Michigan mid-May is the earliest to plant tomatoes in the ground. Even that can be iffy. Late May is usually safe. I would imagine your area would be very close to these target dates. Don't worry if you already have plants growing. I don't think there is a person on this forum who didn't jump the gun and get started too early at some point in time. With age comes ...(clearing throat)...wisdom and patience. At least a little bit. LOL.

Good luck!

Duane

**carolyn137** · March 13, 2008

What gardening zone are you in MA b'c there are several.

I'm close by in NYS in a mostly zone 5 area and don't start sowing until about April 1st. Last average frost date here is May 15th and I wouldn't dream of having plants set out until the first of June, weather permitting, b'c of all the frosts I've dealt with in late May in past years of growing, which is several decades worth.

HakaiRah · March 13, 2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by carolyn137

What gardening zone are you in MA b'c there are several.

I'm close by in NYS in a mostly zone 5 area and don't start sowing until about April 1st. Last average frost date here is May 15th and I wouldn't dream of having plants set out until the first of June, weather permitting, b'c of all the frosts I've dealt with in late May in past years of growing, which is several decades worth.

According to http://www.usna.usda.gov/Hardzone/hzm-ne1.html I'd fall right on the 6a/6b border. From what I know of local weather we stabilize pretty early since we're not all that far from the ocean (relatively at 25 miles). At the same time its New England and we can have some pretty freak weather. We're as close to the ocean as we are to zone 5.

We're SE of Worcester which has an average last frost of the 27th of April according to the Old Farmer's Almanac http://www.almanac.com/garden/frostus.php

I think I'm going to keep a close watch on the weather come early may and once things look 'safe' I'll start a staggered planting to mitigate risk. I think the Garden's location will insulate it some from extreme weather as we're on the edge of a wetland forest, but I'm not sure.

Since I'm ahead of schedule with my seedlings does anyone have suggestions on when to transplant them out of the 4 inch pots to something larger?

celticman · March 13, 2008

If you are worried about frost and your seedling are getting to big put them in larger pots. General it only one or two nights you have to worry with so they can reside outside. I push a couple toms every year to the point they are in five gallon buckets.
Congrades on the house and garden.
Celtic

barkeater · March 14, 2008

When the roots start growing out of the bottom of your 4" pots, then it's time to move them up to larger ones.

Little_Rhody · March 21, 2008

Hi there,

I'm in a Boston suburb, but my main garden is in Rhode Island. I start seeds around April 1st. It has been my experience that it does'nt matter how big they are when you put them out (some time between May 15th to May 31st for me for both gardens). The plants don't take off until the weather gets warm. If I put them out before Memorial Day weekend, which is kind of the rule where I am, I worry, but thankfully, I've never had a killing frost. Just keep an eye on the weather and pray! Good luck with your new garden It sound like you are off to a great start.

Catntree · March 22, 2008

Hi,

My friends near Springfield, Mass plant on Mother's day, usually.

Tree

March 13, 2008	#1
HakaiRah Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Franklin, Massachusetts Zone 6a/b Posts: 46	Greetings from the Frigid North I'd like to thank everyone on this forum for the amazing wealth of knowledge I've been able to mine over the past couple weeks while lurking about. While I was able to plop some plants into the ground at the start of July last year when we finally moved out of our apartment into a house, this will be the first year my wife and I get a real garden. I grew up helping my Mom garden, and visiting her father's amazing garden and seedling factory. Ok, it was just his basement but it felt like a factory to me at the time. Still, it's been over a decade since I last seriously helped out. Tomatoes are at the top of my list of things to grow, because I love them through gels and seeds dribbled down the front of my shirt after a bite out of a freshly picked one to heartburn from sauces. I do know I'm incredibly jealous of all the southerners that already have plants in the ground. I've got seedlings under lights, but we've got over a month before it'll be safe to drop them in the ground. We have a ton of work to do to prepare all of our beds, because we only have around 4 inches of topsoil. Underneath its dense sand, and large glacial rocks. We're excavating to a little over a foot down, and will be bringing in dirt to replace the rocks and sand. We're moving the sand to create a second raised hill in our back yard. It'll be a long term project in soil improvement, where the garden beds are getting around 10 cubic yards of imported loam. It's a shortcut, but will let us build out our first 750 sqft of garden this spring instead of it being a multi-year project. I guess impatience is the curse of the fast food generation. Thanks again for your store of knowledge, which hopefully in the coming months I might just be able to add a thing or two too. My Tomato list for this year: Black Cherry Black Crimson Carmello Cherokee Purple Italian Tree Lollipop Mexico Tommy Toe Brandywine Bloody Butcher - (I couldn't resist the name) Sweet Baby Girl Druzba

March 13, 2008	#2
Dukerdawg Growing for Market Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Westland, Michigan Posts: 861	Hey there! Congrats on the new house and of course on your first garden there. Sounds like you are doing all the right things to get off to a great start. I know it seems like I own stock (I don't really!) in these varieties, but I would add Aunt Gerties Gold and/or Yellow Brandywine to your list. Both are exceptional and you have plenty of time to start seeds. I won't even start my main crop for a couple of weeks yet. PM me your address if you want seeds and I can send you some. Wish you the best and happy gardening! Duane __________________ May I aspire to live my life so that I may be the man my dog thinks I am.

March 13, 2008	#5
Dukerdawg Growing for Market Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Westland, Michigan Posts: 861	Here in Michigan mid-May is the earliest to plant tomatoes in the ground. Even that can be iffy. Late May is usually safe. I would imagine your area would be very close to these target dates. Don't worry if you already have plants growing. I don't think there is a person on this forum who didn't jump the gun and get started too early at some point in time. With age comes ...(clearing throat)...wisdom and patience. At least a little bit. LOL. Good luck! Duane __________________ May I aspire to live my life so that I may be the man my dog thinks I am.

March 13, 2008	#6
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	What gardening zone are you in MA b'c there are several. I'm close by in NYS in a mostly zone 5 area and don't start sowing until about April 1st. Last average frost date here is May 15th and I wouldn't dream of having plants set out until the first of June, weather permitting, b'c of all the frosts I've dealt with in late May in past years of growing, which is several decades worth. __________________ Carolyn

March 21, 2008	#10
Little_Rhody Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: RI Posts: 106	Hi there, I'm in a Boston suburb, but my main garden is in Rhode Island. I start seeds around April 1st. It has been my experience that it does'nt matter how big they are when you put them out (some time between May 15th to May 31st for me for both gardens). The plants don't take off until the weather gets warm. If I put them out before Memorial Day weekend, which is kind of the rule where I am, I worry, but thankfully, I've never had a killing frost. Just keep an eye on the weather and pray! Good luck with your new garden It sound like you are off to a great start. __________________ carolyn

March 13, 2008	#3
barkeater Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NE Kingdom, VT - Zone 3b Posts: 1,439	Welcome! You won't be able to resist the earliness and flavor of Bloody Butcher too. If it was larger it'd be the perfect tomato. You might want to add Moskvich for an early, great flavored, large red. BTW, you have 2 months, minimum, before you can plant tomatoes in the ground in Massachusetts.

March 13, 2008	#8
celticman Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: NC Posts: 170	If you are worried about frost and your seedling are getting to big put them in larger pots. General it only one or two nights you have to worry with so they can reside outside. I push a couple toms every year to the point they are in five gallon buckets. Congrades on the house and garden. Celtic

March 14, 2008	#9
barkeater Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NE Kingdom, VT - Zone 3b Posts: 1,439	When the roots start growing out of the bottom of your 4" pots, then it's time to move them up to larger ones.

March 22, 2008	#11
Catntree Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Maine Posts: 177	Hi, My friends near Springfield, Mass plant on Mother's day, usually. Tree __________________ Zone 4/5