Question about calcium nitrate and the Actinovate, Biota Max and Mycogrow soil drench

[bdank]

Does anyone (Raybo? Ami?) know if using 1 tsp of calcium nitrate as a weekly 'snack' that is poured down the fill tube on my earthboxes will harm the beneficials in the Actinovate, Biota Max and Mycogrow soil drench?

[amideutch]

I don't see any problem, how about you Ray. Ami

[fortyonenorth]

Slightly off topic, but there was an interesting article in this month's Acres USA discussing the nitrogen cycle and how it much more complex than once believed. One of the takeaways is that the soil biota which favor organic sources of nitrogen are different from those favoring synthetic nitrogen. So, there really is sound science behind the assertion that soils become "hooked" on synthetic fertilizers.

This would suggest that using calcium nitrate with the other products you mention would not be a complimentary pairing. There's obviously a lot more research to be done on this subject, but I thought I would throw this out.

[Dewayne mater]

bdank - there was a good discussion or two about the snack in earthboxes two summers ago. Lots of details. Worth a check out. I used the snack that year and it ended BER for me, as well as increased production, plant vigor too. I use those products mentioned (and others) and found over the last two years no adverse consequences. Can't tell you any scientific basis for harm/no harm, but, based on my experience, I have continued to use the snack as it heats up and a lot fruit is set.

Dewayne mater

[rnewste]

bdank,

I would err on the side of caution and cut your dosage in half - - at least until you gain some "feedback" re: plant health. Last Season, I hit a few of the plants with a full Tablespoon, and it almost killed the plants. They did recover, but the damage was done.

Down the filler tube may be less of a shock as compared to how I applied it - - but exercise caution would be my recommendation.

Raybo

[DogsandDirt]

Raybo,

I'm curious to know whether you used calcium nitrate granules or liquid concentrate that was so detrimental? I have traditional containers and give some of the plants 1/2 Tbsp of the granules once per week since they're still somewhat small compared to "adult height." I'm debating when to increase to 1 full Tbsp. If a full Tbsp in going to hurt them I'll stick to 1/2. I also occasionally give them a liquid concentrate, Cal-Mag Bloom from Agricultural Organics, added to the watering can (1 ml/L). So far I haven't seen any ill effects from either product and (cross my fingers, knock on wood, pray to tomato gods, etc) only have one tomato with BER.

[bdank]

Thanks for your input everyone. Over on the Earthbox forum using the 'snack' is quite popular; folks there use 1 tsp once a week. I tried it myself last year and had good results, but I started wondering if it's compatible with Ami's beneficial soil drench. I hate to think I've been wasting money on those products by unknowingly haming them with other products.

[rnewste]

As I recall from another post several weeks ago, only a high Phosphate (P) level is damaging to the mycos. The recommendation was to keep the P at under a 5 number. Calcium Nitrate is 15-0-0 for reference.

My "mistake" was administering a Tablespoon dose at one time which likely shocked the plants. A Teaspoon at a time will be fine.

However, I would be cautious about an instant does of even 1 Teaspoon into the EB water reservoir. That concentration might be detrimental to your plants. Again, I would start with 1/2 Teaspoon into the filler tube per week, then if you see no wilting - crank it up to a full Teaspoon.

As an aside, I am hearing positive reports about Cal-Mag type products for tomato plants. Again, one can go crazy chasing after every new product on the market - so let common sense prevail on down-selecting only those few which produce above average results. Lots of stuff in the Hydroponics area is still "snake oil".

Raybo

[Dewayne mater]

Now that Raybo mentioned it, I remembered that the product I used was actually Cal-Mag. It was Botanicare's Cal Mag Plus, a liquid product purchased at a hydro store. Sure perked up a season for me. Not sure I can hold off disease long enough this year to really need it as it was something that was hugely beneficial after the plants were stressing with being heavily fruit set and having to deal with summer type heat. Here is an old link with great discussion of the snack and BER: http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=14513

I didn't do a comparison to Calcium Nitrate to know if it would have done the same as Cal-Mag, but I know the Cal-Mag worked for me. I used an Ortho hose end sprayer in the fill tube to deliver the Cal-Mag at the recommended rate. That was the only way I felt sure I wasn't over adding the Calcium, as I like to keep water in the tainers and not run them all the way dry and I couldn't be sure that the Calcium wasn't pooling at the bottom of the reservoir. Good luck.

Dewayne mater

[fortyonenorth]

Originally Posted by rnewste

As I recall from another post several weeks ago, only a high Phosphate (P) level is damaging to the mycos. The recommendation was to keep the P at under a 5 number. Calcium Nitrate is 15-0-0 for reference.

I agree, Ray. The antagonism between mycos and phosphorus levels is the most publicized, but there is a body of research which suggests that mineral salts (e.g. nitrates) suppress the colonization of mycos.

My general point is that stuff like beneficial bacteria and fungi help promote (and benefit from) a healthy soil. Generally speaking, synthetic fertilizers are at odds with that goal. It doesn't mean you can't grow good plants using synthetics (consider "old" Tomato Tone as a case in point) it's just that by so doing you are minimizing the effectiveness of the soil microorganisms and relying more on the fertilizer - it's "feed the plant" vs. "feed the soil."

In the end, the goal is to produce great tomatoes - not to grow mycos. I think that's a point that gets lost in some of the discussions. As President Kennedy famously pronounced: "Ask not what you can do for your mycos, ask what your mycos can do for you."