Tomatoville® Gardening Forums - View Single Post - ramblings of a non-profit donation garden

JackE · January 15, 2011

Hi Jonathan --

I know your best buddy, David (a little,"insider" joke - don't pursue it LOL) Yes, 25,000 seeds. Seed companies always use the old Roman M instead of the modern K to designate 1000. Tradition, I guess. But you probably don't need that GMO seed. Insects and diseases are nowhere near the problem up there as down here. The old varieties taste better, just like heirloom tomatoes! B

But your foodbank "market" is not going to be very discriminating. Just be sure you stay 100% on-label -, NO guesswork - when you use chemicals. And it's a good idea, to protect the church from potential liability, to always get approval from the exension agent and keep a record of it. Also, be very careful in handling produce to avoid possible bacterial contamination - don't, for example, trim the end of the corn to get rid of the earworm! (Our ladies were doing that at the vegetable stand and the health inspector warned us not to cut, peel or process anything!-that's when we went GMO)

Just about every food product contains corn in some form, even soft drinks use corn sweeteners, and virtually ALL of it is GMO corn. It worries some people. Unkown, long-term environmental effects worry me too (good movie plot - "Killer Worms From Hell" LOL) but you won't be in business long if you don't keep-up with technologies.

I've planted Bodacious - a good corn. Merit was always my favorite, though - exeptionally large ear. Corn is a nitrogen hog - it takes a LOT of N, and 3 tons of chicken manure/acre will deliver a LOT of N - at 12% (average for chucken poop), that would be 720# of N/acre/year - 100# of N/acre/year is considered adequate for corn. You sure DON'T have a fertility issue - unless it's potential for nitrogen burn. LOL Seriously, you Can burn stuff with chicken manure - I dumped a load next to a tree one time, for later use, and it killed the tree!! However, the N content will be lower if it's litter (sawdust, hay and stuff) - still plenty hot though. Unfortunately, all the poultry growers in our county are gone now. You're lucky to get it - nowadays, around here at least, the chicken farmers sell it to commercial composters under a contract arrangement. It's not free anymore!

.WATER - in normal years (which don't seem to exist anymore), we get a lot of rain, but even then some irrigation is necessary. I pump my water from a 4 acre pond on a year-round creek, and the other two growers each have 4" irrigation wells. I have one acre under gravity drip and two acres under sprinklers. The sprinklers are zoned, and my pump will handle 15 - 3/4" sprinklers at time, covering 1/2 acre per zone.

We couldn't possibly garden without water anymore - we used to be able to depend on rainfall but the weather has changed here. We don't get those summer thunderstorms 3 or 4 times a week like we used to - now it's a gulley washer followed by weeks of drought! And our sandy soil loses moisture quickly. Fortunately, our water table is very shallow (plenty at 40' on my place) and a usable 4" irrigation well can be completed for about $5K anywhere around here, including the submersible pump and all.

My dam was built by my father over 60 years ago, but I'm afraid the next hurricane will finish it off. The neighbors lake upstream was damaged in Rita and washed-out in Ike, sending a 6' head of water over my dam. It's holding by a thread, and will not be repairable because of new state regs - you can't just pile dirt across the creek with a dozer anymore - they require a concrete, steel-reinforced spillway, etc etc - prohibitive cost - 6 figures!

Ike and Rita were the first storms in my 75-year memory to bring full hurricane force winds to us - we're 80 miles north of the Gulf! Our church was always an evacuation shelter for Beaumont residents, but in Rite WE had to evacuate. Unbelievable!

I don't know your weather, but you probably need an irrigation well - maybe not as expensive as you think - and a long-term improvement for the church. Community or city water costs are absolutely prohibitive everywhere - at least in Texas. For anything more than a home garden, you gotta have a well - but they don't have to be deep like a drinking water well. You can use the cloudy, shallow water to irrigate with - as long as it is bacteria-free.

Jack

PS -- Might not be a bad idea to get that soil checked in a lab before adding more chicken manure again this spring - it is possible to overdo it. (We ALL wish we had THAT problem!)

January 15, 2011	#7
JackE Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Woodville, Texas Posts: 520	Hi Jonathan -- I know your best buddy, David (a little,"insider" joke - don't pursue it LOL) Yes, 25,000 seeds. Seed companies always use the old Roman M instead of the modern K to designate 1000. Tradition, I guess. But you probably don't need that GMO seed. Insects and diseases are nowhere near the problem up there as down here. The old varieties taste better, just like heirloom tomatoes! B But your foodbank "market" is not going to be very discriminating. Just be sure you stay 100% on-label -, NO guesswork - when you use chemicals. And it's a good idea, to protect the church from potential liability, to always get approval from the exension agent and keep a record of it. Also, be very careful in handling produce to avoid possible bacterial contamination - don't, for example, trim the end of the corn to get rid of the earworm! (Our ladies were doing that at the vegetable stand and the health inspector warned us not to cut, peel or process anything!-that's when we went GMO) Just about every food product contains corn in some form, even soft drinks use corn sweeteners, and virtually ALL of it is GMO corn. It worries some people. Unkown, long-term environmental effects worry me too (good movie plot - "Killer Worms From Hell" LOL) but you won't be in business long if you don't keep-up with technologies. I've planted Bodacious - a good corn. Merit was always my favorite, though - exeptionally large ear. Corn is a nitrogen hog - it takes a LOT of N, and 3 tons of chicken manure/acre will deliver a LOT of N - at 12% (average for chucken poop), that would be 720# of N/acre/year - 100# of N/acre/year is considered adequate for corn. You sure DON'T have a fertility issue - unless it's potential for nitrogen burn. LOL Seriously, you Can burn stuff with chicken manure - I dumped a load next to a tree one time, for later use, and it killed the tree!! However, the N content will be lower if it's litter (sawdust, hay and stuff) - still plenty hot though. Unfortunately, all the poultry growers in our county are gone now. You're lucky to get it - nowadays, around here at least, the chicken farmers sell it to commercial composters under a contract arrangement. It's not free anymore! .WATER - in normal years (which don't seem to exist anymore), we get a lot of rain, but even then some irrigation is necessary. I pump my water from a 4 acre pond on a year-round creek, and the other two growers each have 4" irrigation wells. I have one acre under gravity drip and two acres under sprinklers. The sprinklers are zoned, and my pump will handle 15 - 3/4" sprinklers at time, covering 1/2 acre per zone. We couldn't possibly garden without water anymore - we used to be able to depend on rainfall but the weather has changed here. We don't get those summer thunderstorms 3 or 4 times a week like we used to - now it's a gulley washer followed by weeks of drought! And our sandy soil loses moisture quickly. Fortunately, our water table is very shallow (plenty at 40' on my place) and a usable 4" irrigation well can be completed for about $5K anywhere around here, including the submersible pump and all. My dam was built by my father over 60 years ago, but I'm afraid the next hurricane will finish it off. The neighbors lake upstream was damaged in Rita and washed-out in Ike, sending a 6' head of water over my dam. It's holding by a thread, and will not be repairable because of new state regs - you can't just pile dirt across the creek with a dozer anymore - they require a concrete, steel-reinforced spillway, etc etc - prohibitive cost - 6 figures! Ike and Rita were the first storms in my 75-year memory to bring full hurricane force winds to us - we're 80 miles north of the Gulf! Our church was always an evacuation shelter for Beaumont residents, but in Rite WE had to evacuate. Unbelievable! I don't know your weather, but you probably need an irrigation well - maybe not as expensive as you think - and a long-term improvement for the church. Community or city water costs are absolutely prohibitive everywhere - at least in Texas. For anything more than a home garden, you gotta have a well - but they don't have to be deep like a drinking water well. You can use the cloudy, shallow water to irrigate with - as long as it is bacteria-free. Jack PS -- Might not be a bad idea to get that soil checked in a lab before adding more chicken manure again this spring - it is possible to overdo it. (We ALL wish we had THAT problem!) Last edited by JackE; January 16, 2011 at 08:37 AM.