[QUOTE=isuhunter;640580]I have yet to see a slug in my garden here in Iowa.[/QUOTE]

What's your address I will send you some. :lol:
As soon as the sprouts and plants get big enough I'm going to lay down some cypress mulch in one bed.
Worth

[QUOTE=MadScientist;640578]Does anyone use landscape fabric? I put some down over 4-6" of semi-composted leaves, but I am worried its keeping the soil underneath too dry--it seems more water repellent than I expected. any suggestions?[/QUOTE]

From people in the know I have read it is a joke and a waste of money for the very reason you stated.
It repels water.
Worth

Weed roots grow through the landscape fabric making them a pain to remove. I learned the hard way a couple years ago.

I use landscape cloth to line my raised beds hubby built with a bottom in them, and my big containers to keep the soil from washing out. I also use it to hold a pile of dirt I've laid out for a new bed out front to keep it from washing away. I then remove it after the worms have been at work at least 6 months on the cardboard I laid underneath the dirt. By this time I have a nice garden bed to work with. Can't wait to get the front planted with some greenery and flowers of some sort. It looks so boring at my house out front. I have found that water gets through just fine after a rain because I can put my foot on it and water seeps out at my shoes, and the soil feels soft.

[QUOTE=AlittleSalt;640694]Weed roots grow through the landscape fabric making them a pain to remove. I learned the hard way a couple years ago.[/QUOTE]

It was on a video about top ten landscaping mistakes I saw some time ago.
A very good video a woman presented.
Worth

It's not a waster of money for me. All weed blocks are not the same. The fabric type of weed block may be guilty of several infractions - dryness, weeds growing on top, etc.

The shiny type woven polypropylene blocks light but not water. It actually saves me trips out to the garden just to water. Does a good job of keeping weeds out if you have taken care of that before laying the fabric down. This is not like a plastic garbage bag. You can see the weave. Good stuff, I have been using it for 2 years. Helps so much when you get old like me.

- Lisa

[QUOTE=greenthumbomaha;640697]It's not a waster of money for me. All weed blocks are not the same. The fabric type of weed block may be guilty of several infractions - dryness, weeds growing on top, etc.

The shiny type woven polypropylene blocks light but not water. It actually saves me trips out to the garden just to water. Does a good job of keeping weeds out if you have taken care of that before laying the fabric down. This is not like a plastic garbage bag. You can see the weave. Good stuff, I have been using it for 2 years. Helps so much when you get old like me.

- Lisa[/QUOTE]


No they aren't the same but some of the stuff repels more water that it absorbed.
One of the worst nightmares I have encountered was thick plastic vapor barrier under random sized river gravel for a cactus sprawling yucca patch gone wild.

It was here when I bought the place and took forever to get out and clean up.
I still have one to dig out in front of the house.
I hope that plastic isn't there too.:(
Try digging through raw unfiltered river gravel/rocks dirt dead cacti, yucca and roots.

Worth

3 mil woven landscape fabric. Water passes through but not weeds. Can be used year after year unlike plastic.
Like mentioned above, not the fibery stuff so weeds don't push through or grow on top.
Two lines of drip tape underneath.
Burn the holes with a long handled torch that attaches to a camp stove bottle.
Drill holes into a piece of plywood and lay that on the fabric and burn where the holes are in the board so you don't melt a bigger hole than you want, plus it sets up your plant spacing automatically.
Pin it down with 6" sod staples.

This one is for my strawberry planting:

[ATTACH]72960[/ATTACH]

Garlic:

[ATTACH]72965[/ATTACH]

Putting straw along the edges of the fabric is a must or you will have a forest growing along the edges that have to be trimmed/mowed/or hand pulled. Or you'd have to very carefully spray if you are ok with herbicides.

Here you can see where straw has kept down all weeds along the edges. i have pulled zero weeds to date in the garlic areas.

[ATTACH]72971[/ATTACH]

Here is an un-strawed edge. Weeds are coming along. You should see it now. They are 6" tall. I am going to trim them down, then cut a 1' strip of fabric off of my 3' wide roll and pin it down along the edge to smother them down.

[ATTACH]72972[/ATTACH]

I mulch with whatever is at hand... This years combo, dried out asparagus branches, prunings from my roses, dried fig leaves mixed with pine needles, etc. I like straw the best but bales are not available nearby so I try to make due with what I have. I also mulch my melons with black plastic to increase the soil temperature.

[QUOTE=Worth1;640712]No they aren't the same but some of the stuff repels more water that it absorbed.
One of the worst nightmares I have encountered was thick plastic vapor barrier under random sized river gravel for a cactus sprawling yucca patch gone wild.

It was here when I bought the place and took forever to get out and clean up.
I still have one to dig out in front of the house.
I hope that plastic isn't there too.:(
Try digging through raw unfiltered river gravel/rocks dirt dead cacti, yucca and roots.

Worth[/QUOTE]

I inherited that same mess. Under gravel, then a layer of stone. Grrr.

[QUOTE=PureHarvest;640748]3 mil woven landscape fabric. Water passes through but not weeds. Can be used year after year unlike plastic.
Like mentioned above, not the fibery stuff so weeds don't push through or grow on top.
Two lines of drip tape underneath.
Burn the holes with a long handled torch that attaches to a camp stove bottle.

Do you have a good source for that. I need some for a couple beds i may just sit
dormant for this year...one will be a bed prepped for garlic next Fall. Or i may Find a
good reusable field tarp i see some small farms use...no hurry. I like re-useable.

Nothing short of 3/4 inch steel plate or 8 inches of reinforced concrete will stop nut grass.
I have seen it grow up through the bottom of the above ground swimming pools and live.

Worth

I generally mulch with straw. In the spring I buy maybe three or four bales of straw (unless I was able to find any freebies after the fall) and thats usually enough to mulch the paths between my beds and the beds themselves.

Then in the fall when I pull the tomatoes and peppers i take all the straw that was in the beds and throw it in the paths. Then I cover the beds with about 2 or 3 inches of shredded leaves unless I have a cover crop planted.

The straw has many advantages but the primary reason I use it in my beds is to prevent soil splash and keep things relatively moist so I'm not watering everyday in the hottest part of the summer.

Weed control - whats your mulch process?
 

So far there is only one "weed" making it up through my oak leaf mulch -- oak tree seedlings!

I've been pulling two to three dozen a day out of my beds. My husband mulched the leaves pretty well before I put them on the beds last fall, so I'm not sure if the mower blades missed all the acorns, or if I have fat, lazy squirrels who can't be bothered to come back for them.

[QUOTE=oakley;641268][QUOTE=PureHarvest;640748]3 mil woven landscape fabric. Water passes through but not weeds. Can be used year after year unlike plastic.
Like mentioned above, not the fibery stuff so weeds don't push through or grow on top.
Two lines of drip tape underneath.
Burn the holes with a long handled torch that attaches to a camp stove bottle.

Do you have a good source for that. I need some for a couple beds i may just sit
dormant for this year...one will be a bed prepped for garlic next Fall. Or i may Find a
good reusable field tarp i see some small farms use...no hurry. I like re-useable.[/QUOTE]

[URL="https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SI9O9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1"]https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SI9O9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1[/URL]

This is the brand and mil I use. Comes in other widths and lengths too.

I was looking for at the same Dewitt ones at Amazon. I forgot if they would ship it directly to Canada, then I discovered that you can order it at Home Depot's online shop, they'll ship it free to the specified local store and you can go and pick it up.

Then while shopping at Costco, I found they have rolls of weed barrier fabric, 1.1 meter widex70 meter long, which is like over 250 feet long , for under $35., actually cheaper per foot. Not sure the actual performance difference, but it's good enough for me, so I bought a few, nice and easy.

Thought I would post this if others are also shopping for similiar stuff.



[QUOTE=PureHarvest;641331][QUOTE=oakley;641268]

[URL="https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SI9O9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1"]https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SI9O9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1[/URL]

This is the brand and mil I use. Comes in other widths and lengths too.[/QUOTE]

I have used fabric and as a weed barrier it is excellent. My only problem is once fabric is down it wants to stay down and when I want to rotate crops it needs to get rolled up and then re-applied after tilling and adding organics to the soil. Mine was fairly expensive and lasted only a couple of years before it began to tear. That's when I switched to cheaper newspaper and just tilled it all in in the fall.

I just returned from the Catskill farm last night. Three days, first visit. I was reminded
of all the stupid things i've done over the years. I have a few varieties in the garden
shed. Rarely use them. The Costco roll bought probably 6-7 yrs ago is fine for some
things. It is great for a summer squash mound if a week of rain is predicted as it does
repel about 50% water. Also feels weird, kinda thick and not 'conforming' to the
landscape. Seems it would be best under gravel/stones/sand. For pathways. Some
non-decomposing weight on it would improve drainage.

I stupidly put it around my blueberry bushes, over some aged clear pine shavings. Then
covered with a couple bags of bark mulch. That is the stupid part. I just wanted do
smother some horseradish roots popping up everywhere.

The bark broke down year two and started growing hay like a cow pasture, then grew
down through the barrier. What a mess. Seems stuck for life.
-lesson 2, plant horseradish far away and contained in its own bed.
Straw has saved that mess over thick wet newspaper. Sort of.

The good news - the narrow paths between some beds using wet newspaper are clear
of all weeds. The beds properly put to bed in the Fall and covered are a dream to work,
double dig, and ready to plant.
Two new beds, one i used straw as a mulch, one was not mulched being a late
planted tom bed. Neither beds were put to bed properly last Fall. The straw mulched
bed had minor weeds. The other is a mess, like starting over in a hay field. Nasty weeds.

All weed barriers have their place and use. Covering fabrics with something organic will
extend their life. As long as they are remove in the Fall clean-up and stored.

Free organic matter is best, if it does not cause problems like suffocation and attracting
slugs. Organic mater can be dug in improving soil.

Using a neighbors lawn and leaf bags could contain pesticides.

Weed barrier is great and when used properly saves a tremendous amount of labor BUT most people make a few mistakes. I have been a landscaper for 22 years, take it from me you need to get the thickest stuff you can find. I use 6 oz, and if I cant find that I use the 5.2 oz. Second- If you cover any weed barrier you 100% will eventually have weeds grow on top of it. For garden use I don't recommend putting anything over it unless it is pine straw or something similar that wont break down rapidly into soil. Straw works well too but really no point unless you just hate the way it looks.

Thank you for your informative posts, Oakley and BVV. I was just thinking about making some similiar mistakes, coving up the ever.rigorous gout weed in my berry beds and put mulch on top of the fabric. Now I have to be more careful about what to use as mulch. Every year I dig and pull countless gout weed tuber/roots in the spring, then they will come back in no time next season around, it is a losing battle for sure.

Here is what I settled on. 1.5 bales across the garden mainly the tomato area. I can't believe how strong the waterhemp is coming in my garden. Its really becoming an issue in the fields around here.

[URL=http://s584.photobucket.com/user/isuhunter/media/Mobile%20Uploads/FB5487F0-231C-40E3-B7E9-8043C547E691_zps6ikzo6vp.jpg.html][IMG]http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss287/isuhunter/Mobile%20Uploads/FB5487F0-231C-40E3-B7E9-8043C547E691_zps6ikzo6vp.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

That's a neat idea, putting the pieces of drainage pipe around the plants. I have not seen that before.

[QUOTE=PureHarvest;641331][QUOTE=oakley;641268]

[URL]https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004SI9O9S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1[/URL]

This is the brand and mil I use. Comes in other widths and lengths too.[/QUOTE]

I like your method and I've seen it elsewhere on the web. Would it be overkill for my four 4x25 foot beds? I could have four different 'cut-outs' and rotate them as I rotate my beds. Does it really let water through without any problem?

I've been using composted pine mulch so far, and I'm trying to save the time of going and getting a yard of it and spreading it, plus I'm ignorant of what years of repeated pine mulch might do to my soil composition.

[QUOTE=BigVanVader;641392]Weed barrier is great and when used properly saves a tremendous amount of labor BUT most people make a few mistakes. I have been a landscaper for 22 years, take it from me you need to get the thickest stuff you can find. I use 6 oz, and if I cant find that I use the 5.2 oz. Second- If you cover any weed barrier you 100% will eventually have weeds grow on top of it. For garden use I don't recommend putting anything over it unless it is pine straw or something similar that wont break down rapidly into soil. Straw works well too but really no point unless you just hate the way it looks.[/QUOTE]

So, Big Van Vader and others, do you have a favorite brand of weed barrier? I have been thinking about DeWitt Pro-5 but would be interested in others experiences with other brands. My garden used to be a pasture and still wants to be, so need something to keep down the grass or I may give up! Thanks for all replys.:no:

I have been experimenting with old carpet. It works better than even the most expensive weed cloth with UV-inhibitor, which weeds grow right through...expect from the top down. The seeds sprout on top, grow through the cloth, and then the cloth acts to help the weed, by mulching everything else out.

I use a combo of things, including plastic mulch/fabric. My favorite however is salt marsh hay, a bit expensive in large quantities, but just the coolest stuff. Over a couple of years, it gently breaks down and adds to conditioning the soil.

I use something that is a "salt hay substitute" that it says is chopped hay and straw dehydrated at high temperatures to kill weed seeds and fungus, etc, on the package. Also a little pricey, but works great for me. I spend very little time weeding, maybe 5 minutes at a time 3 or 4 times per season, if that, and it also breaks down to condition the soil. Mine is called Mainely Mulch. Anything you can buy similar should do the same thing, I would think. The price is worth the decrease in work for me, but I don't have a huge garden, maybe 12x15 ft or a little bigger. If you plant 100+ tomato plants per year or have a 1/4 acre garden, it is probably going to be more expensive than most people would like.

I've switched to carpet as well. The weed fabric works great for me in row but it wears out to fast on the areas that have heavy foot traffic. I got a huge roll of auto carpet for free and it should last years. I've found stale seed bedding and cover cropping very effective for weed control as well. Many techniques are needed to beat weeds but with patience it can be done.

I haven't yet used all of what I already have, but I have thought about putting up a craigslist ad offering to remove old carpet for free. I think people would jump on that offer. No one wants their stinky old carpet.

[QUOTE=Cole_Robbie;674282]I haven't yet used all of what I already have, but I have thought about putting up a craigslist ad offering to remove old carpet for free. I think people would jump on that offer. No one wants their stinky old carpet.[/QUOTE]

A guy runs a worm farm close by and wants everyone's old carpet for
his worm beds, not sure how he uses it.